Antarctic Ice Discussion

[knocker]

Coastal Antarctic permafrost melting faster than expected

 

For the first time, scientists have documented an acceleration in the melt rate of permafrost, or ground ice, in a section of Antarctica where the ice had been considered stable. The melt rates are comparable with the Arctic, where accelerated melting of permafrost has become a regularly recurring phenomenon, and the change could offer a preview of melting permafrost in other parts of a warming Antarctic continent.

 

http://phys.org/news/2013-07-coastal-antarctic-permafrost-faster.html

Edited August 27, 2013 by knocker

[minus 9]

Ice drift is it now. Surely co2 rising means temps rising= less sea ice. Not in Antarctica. Oh I forgot its more fresh water from the melting glaciers in the Antarctic flowing into the sea. Another theory. More sea ice colder temps simple as.

[loafer]

Person A: The sea is acting as the heat sink, that is where all the warming that should be showing has gone.

Person B: So how come the sea is freezing more in the Antarctic?

Person A: Ah. Don't worry, a fresh theory will be along any day. Bear with.

[keithlucky]

Only 47713 sq km

off last year record with 2 to 4 weeks left another all time record to be broken

Antarctic Sea Ice Extent (NSIDC) broke 19,000,000 sq km on August 25th (day 237). That was the earliest ever.

The previous earliest to break 19 million was August 29 2006 (day 241).

Yesterday was also the 30th daily record of the year.  And 7th in a row.

The record for most ice ever is day 266 in 2012 when the ice extent was 19.47713 million sq km.

Edited August 27, 2013 by keithlucky

[knocker]

Person A: The sea is acting as the heat sink, that is where all the warming that should be showing has gone.

Person B: So how come the sea is freezing more in the Antarctic?

Person A: Ah. Don't worry, a fresh theory will be along any day. Bear with.

 

That's a bit odd. I wonder whether BAS know what they are talking about.

 

Press Release - Warming Antarctic seas likely to impact on krill habitats

Antarctic krill are usually less than 6 cm in length but their size belies the major role they play in sustaining much of the life in the Southern Ocean. They are the primary food source for many species of whales, seals, penguins and fish.

 

Krill are known to be sensitive to sea temperature, especially in the areas where they grow as adults. This has prompted scientists to try to understand how they might respond to the effects of further climate change.

 

Using statistical models, a team of researchers from the British Antarctic Survey and Plymouth Marine Laboratory assessed the likely impact of projected temperature increases on the Weddell Sea, Scotia Sea and Southern Drake Passage, which is known for its abundance of krill. This region has experienced sea surface warming of as much as 1°C over fifty years. Projections suggest this could rise by another 1°C by the end of the 21st century.

 

 

http://www.antarctica.ac.uk/press/press_releases/press_release.php?id=2283

Edited August 27, 2013 by knocker

[knocker]

Is Antarctica losing or gaining ice?

 

"[ice] is expanding in much of Antarctica, contrary to the widespread public belief that global warming is melting the continental ice cap." (Greg Roberts, The Australian)

 

http://www.skepticalscience.com/antarctica-gaining-ice.htm

Edited August 27, 2013 by knocker

[be cause]

Only 47713 sq km

off last year record with 2 to 4 weeks left another all time record to be broken

Antarctic Sea Ice Extent (NSIDC) broke 19,000,000 sq km on August 25th (day 237). That was the earliest ever.

The previous earliest to break 19 million was August 29 2006 (day 241).

Yesterday was also the 30th daily record of the year.  And 7th in a row.

The record for most ice ever is day 266 in 2012 when the ice extent was 19.47713 million sq km.

 

that would be 477130 sq km to last year's peak .. still a big but not impossible goal 

 

... and as for the Krill .. I would suggest the threat from rapid over-fishing is far greater than the threat from AGW .

Edited August 27, 2013 by be cause

[knocker]

I didn't mention AGW, merely the fact that SSTs in the area were warming.

[knocker]

East Antarctic Ice Sheet could be more vulnerable to climate change than previously thought

The world's largest ice sheet could be more vulnerable to the effects of climate change than previously thought, according to new research from Durham University.

 

A team from the Department of Geography used declassified spy satellite imagery to create the first long-term record of changes in the terminus of outlet glaciers – where they meet the sea – along 5,400km of the East Antarctic Ice Sheet's coastline. The imagery covered almost half a century from 1963 to 2012.

 

 

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2013-08/du-eai082713.php

Edited August 28, 2013 by knocker

[MidAtlanticob]

We must , however, understand the relation of ice melt, sub ocean cooling, and sea surface temps that guide real-time weather events....

This relationship or correlation, with CO2 readings must be understood. Otherwise it is speculation....

MAO

[be cause]

I didn't mention AGW, merely the fact that SSTs in the area were warming.

I didn't say you did .. my point being that krill on the way to China worry little about any potential warming whatever the cause .. 

[knocker]

Nice photo.

 

Nacreous clouds over Scott Base.

 

https://twitter.com/AntarcticaNZ/status/371907024990113793/photo/1

 

 

[knocker]

Very impressive.

 

Gallery: Antarctic architecture celebrated in 'Ice Lab' exhibition

 

http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2013-07/24/antarctic-architecture

Edited September 11, 2013 by knocker

[keithlucky]

Antarctic sea ice third highest of all time 2012′s maximum was 19.47713 million sq km,2006′s maximum was 19.35934 million sq km 2013′s maximum so far is 19.35119 million sq km .

[knocker]

Far more importantly.

 

Antarctic and Greenland glaciers at risk of “catastrophic breakup†- See more at: http://www.rtcc.org/2013/07/23/antarctic-and-greenland-glaciers-at-risk-of-catastrophic-breakup/#sthash.7Kl9hPOk.dpuf

Edited September 12, 2013 by knocker

[knocker]

Hot streak

 

South Pole experiences record heat in August to end warmest winter ever

 

http://antarcticsun.usap.gov/science/contenthandler.cfm?id=2892

Edited September 15, 2013 by knocker

[stewfox]

Hot streak

 

South Pole experiences record heat in August to end warmest winter ever

 

http://antarcticsun.usap.gov/science/contenthandler.cfm?id=2892

 

There  has been more cloud down there this winter but putting it in perspective

 

""""""""The average temperature for the the winter months in 2013 was minus 66.8F (minus 54.9C). The next warmest temperature during that same period was in 1964, with an average of minus 69F (minus 56.1C)"""""""""

 

Lets see a few more years

Edited September 15, 2013 by stewfox

[minus 9]

Warmest winter since 1957.no records before then.

[stewfox]

Warmest winter since 1957.no records before then.

 

Its like saying London was warmest ever in July so that means whole of Europe was.

 

If they had a 1000 weather stations across the Antarctica in 1957, think not

 

Loads of cold record broken down there

 

http://antarcticsun.usap.gov/science/contenthandler.cfm?id=2860

 

 

A few here

 

-------------------

Then it cooled off in a hurry — and in a big way. By June 6, the temperature had dropped to minus 104.3F (minus 75.7C), well below the previous minimum temperature record of minus 100.3F (minus 73.5C) set in 2004.

The next day, June 7, it got even colder. The temperature of minus 107.9F (minus 77.7C) broke the previous minimum temperature record of minus 99.2F (minus 72.9C), also set in 2004. The temperatures kept to the cellars for a third day, with a record low of minus 107.3F (minus 77.4C), which knocked out another 2004 record of minus 100.5F (minus 73.6).

------------------

 

Christmas day temps anyone ?

 

http://antarcticsun.usap.gov/science/images4/May29-June8TempGraph.jpg

 

Edited September 15, 2013 by stewfox

[minus 9]

Warmest winter ever. Near record sea ice. Oh I know more heat more ice?, do some posters on here work for the bbc

[knocker]

Achilles' heel of ice shelves is beneath the water, scientists reveal

 

New research has revealed that more ice leaves Antarctica by melting from the underside of submerged ice shelves than was previously thought, accounting for as much as 90 per cent of ice loss in some areas.

 

Iceberg production and melting causes 2,800 cubic kilometres of ice to leave the Antarctic ice sheet every year. Most of this is replaced by snowfall but any imbalance contributes to a change in global sea level.

 

For many decades, experts have believed that the most important process responsible for this huge loss was iceberg calving - the breaking off of chunks of ice at the edge of a glacier.

 

New research, led by academics at the University of Bristol with colleagues at Utrecht University and the University of California, has used satellite and climate model data to prove that this sub-shelf melting has as large an impact as iceberg calving for Antarctica as a whole and for some areas is far more important.

 

The findings, published today [15 September] in Nature, are crucial for understanding how the ice sheet interacts with the rest of the climate system and particularly the ocean.

 

 

 

A photo of the calving front of the Filchner Ice Shelf. credit Jonathan Bamber

 

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2013-09/uob-aho091213.php

 

 

Edited September 15, 2013 by knocker

[knocker]

Diagram showing area weighted Antarctic (70-90^oS) monthly surface air temperature anomalies (HadCRUT4) since January 2000, in relation to the WMO normal period 1961-1990.  The thin blue line shows the monthly temperature anomaly, while the thicker red line shows the running 37 month (c.3 yr) average. Last month shown: June 2013. Last diagram update: 15 August 2013.

 

http://www.climate4you.com/

 

 

[loafer]

37 month rolling average is a rather curious metric...any idea why they use this duration?

[Methuselah]

37 month rolling average is a rather curious metric...any idea why they use this duration?

Nearest odd-number to 36 that isn't smaller than 36? Spark?

[stewfox]

Diagram showing area weighted Antarctic (70-90^oS) monthly surface air temperature anomalies (HadCRUT4) since January 2000, in relation to the WMO normal period 1961-1990.  The thin blue line shows the monthly temperature anomaly, while the thicker red line shows the running 37 month (c.3 yr) average. Last month shown: June 2013. Last diagram update: 15 August 2013.

 

http://www.climate4you.com/

 

 

Shows the wide fluctuations in temperature's in the current year as I mentioned above.

 

Might see a little bit more growth in current year

 

http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/S_stddev_timeseries.png