Summers 1979-82 v 1985-88

[Sunny76]

I think mid June onwards in 1990 was ok, similar to 1995. That started off cold.

[hillbilly]

4 hours ago, Sunny76 said:

I remember the World Cup period of 1986 being quite warm or hot, and it was probably the best weather of summer 86.

We had a day trip to France with my school, and the weather was hot and sunny all day, from as early as 4am until 10ish in the evening.

Strange how most World Cup periods coincide with warm sunny weather, even during the poorer summers like 2010.

Even 2002 had some nice sunny weather during the World Cup, and that was a dull summer.

Not quite I clearly remember the 2006 WC in Germany when it started it was unseasonally hot in Germany basking in 30+deg heat but here in the pennines it was 11 deg dull and drizzly with a cold breeze,i had my coat on and my nose was dribbling it was so cold.Yes it warmed up quickly after that.

[cheeky_monkey]

On 06/05/2020 at 10:22, Weather-history said:

Neither did 1990. That June was poor. 

funny i remember watching the Q/F v Cameroon and the semi against Germany in my back garden with friends and some cold beers 

Edited May 7, 2020 by cheeky_monkey

[Weather-history]

1 hour ago, cheeky_monkey said:

funny i remember watching the Q/F v Cameroon and the semi against Germany in my back garden with friends and some cold beers 

I know the semi was on the 4th of July. got to say that does not look "a sit in the garden" chart

Edited May 7, 2020 by Weather-history

[damianslaw]

This has inevitably turned into a thread about summers past rather than comparison to the 2 periods mentioned. With this in mind there are 2 other comparable periods to compare 97-02 vs 07-12. Which was the worst? I suspect 2012 followed by 1998. The best either 1999 or 2001. On the flip side we have the periods 03-06 and 13-16 to compare.. I'll discount 17-19 for balance purpose. Overdue now a return to a period of poorer summers we've had a 7 year run of decent ones... 

[Thundery wintry showers]

Regarding the original topic, to my knowledge the summers of 1979-1982 sound a bit more reasonable to me than 1985-1988, though with some regional variation.  But hunches don't always hold up scientifically, so I took a quick look through the Met Office UK area-average stats for mean maximum temperature, number of rain days and sunshine (the three variables corresponding to the Manchester summer index):

Tmax:

1979-82: 1979 17.58, 1980 17.28, 1981 17.68, 1982 18.51, mean 17.76C

1985-88: 1985 16.91, 1986 17.35, 1987 17.23, 1988 17.48, mean 17.24C

So for maximum temperature it's an easy win for 1979-1982, which averaged 0.5C warmer by day than 1985-1988.

Rain days:

1979-82: 1979 33.0, 1980 43.9, 1981 28.9, 1982 35.7, mean 35.4

1985-88: 1985 50.6, 1986 32.7, 1987 40.1, 1988 41.9, mean 41.3

So again, it's a clear win for 1979-1982.

And last but not least, sunshine:

1979-82: 1979 457.4, 1980 397.2, 1981 447.4, 1982 465.7, mean 437.4

1985-88: 1985 457.9, 1986 467.9, 1987 402.6, 1988 452.4, mean 445.2

So sunshine wise 1985-1988, surprisingly considering the temperature and rain days stats, came out as slightly the sunnier of the two periods. 

Another factor to consider for the thunderstorm lovers is that 1979-1982 had more in the way of notably thundery months: the Junes of 1980 and 1982 both had an unusually high frequency of thunder (1982 was particularly exceptional towards the SE with some sites having 11 to 14 thunder-days, 1980 less exceptional in the SE but more so further north) and the summer of 1981 had quite a few potent thundery events too.  August 1987 as some have noted was a thundery month in places, but generally the summers of 1985-1988 had less in the way of thundery months.

So overall I think 1979-1982 "wins", being only marginally behind for sunshine and ahead on all of the other counts.

And what were the best and worst summers?  According to the three main indices it looks like 1980 and 1987 were the dullest, 1985 the rainiest and coolest.  1981 was the least rainy and 1982 the warmest, but none of those summers stand out for relatively high sunshine.

Edited May 7, 2020 by Thundery wintry showers

[Philipsfd]

Thanks. Struggling to remember much sun and heat during the 2002 World Cup. Can remember the 15th being a bit on the hot side following a washout day on the 14th. But other than that I can remember mainly a lot of cloudy weather, particularly on the days of England's first two group games, and the day of the final.

[Weather-history]

 

The period chosen was 1979-82 but what if it was 1978-81 as a comparison? 1978 wasn't a great summer, get the feeling it may have been worse that 1982. I don't think the summer months 1979-82 were as wet as those of 1985-88. They were some wet months in that 1985-88 period.

 

 

 

[Philipsfd]

1977 wasn't great either was it?

[Thundery wintry showers]

1 hour ago, Weather-history said:

 

The period chosen was 1979-82 but what if it was 1978-81 as a comparison? 1978 wasn't a great summer, get the feeling it may have been worse that 1982. I don't think the summer months 1979-82 were as wet as those of 1985-88. They were some wet months in that 1985-88 period.

Yes, for the UK summer 1978 had a mean max of 16.98C, 36.1 rain days and 418.1 hours of sunshine, so not outstandingly wet in terms of rain days, but strongly on the cool and cloudy side, and over 1.5C cooler by day than the summer of 1982.  So comparing 1978-81 with 1985-88 would lead to it being more open to question which was worse, as 1985-88 would come out as quite significantly sunnier, with comparable daytime max temperatures, but higher rain days.

For the UK as a whole the summer of 1977 comes out fairly cool with close to average sunshine and rain days, because of a reverse NW-SE split with wet and dull weather for the SE and dry and sunny weather for the NW.

Edited May 8, 2020 by Thundery wintry showers

[Weather-history]

On 04/05/2020 at 19:02, Weather-history said:

1987 was rank. Most of June was dire and mid July-mid August 1987 was very poor, I think the first Friday in August it only got to 11C!  

 

 

It got to 12.2C on Friday 7th August 1987

 

 

[Sir Mim]

I remember June 1986 was a fairly sunny and warm month with the rest of the summer being cool and damp, most of summer 1987 being quite cloudy and cool, and 1988 was very wet.  Can't say much about summer 1985 though.

Edited May 10, 2020 by Sir Mim

[Sunny76]

I remember July 1985 having some hot sunny days, but August was cool and cloudy. I don’t remember anything about June 1985.

 

[B87]

On 08/05/2020 at 00:28, damianslaw said:

This has inevitably turned into a thread about summers past rather than comparison to the 2 periods mentioned. With this in mind there are 2 other comparable periods to compare 97-02 vs 07-12. Which was the worst? I suspect 2012 followed by 1998. The best either 1999 or 2001. On the flip side we have the periods 03-06 and 13-16 to compare

97-02 was far superior to the 07-12 period. Much warmer and sunnier.

03-06 had 2 good summers and 2 average summers

13-16 had 2 good summers and 2 average summers.

17-19 had 1 great summer, 1 decent and 1 average.

[B87]

1 hour ago, Sunny76 said:

I remember July 1985 having some hot sunny days, but August was cool and cloudy. I don’t remember anything about June 1985.

 

Very cool and very wet in London.

Meteociel - Climatologie mensuelle de London / Heathrow (UK)

WWW.METEOCIEL.FR

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Résumé mensuel des observations météo ( températures minimales et maximales, précipitations et ensoleillement) de la station...

 

[Sunny76]

1 hour ago, B87 said:

Very cool and very wet in London.

Meteociel - Climatologie mensuelle de London / Heathrow (UK)

WWW.METEOCIEL.FR

---

Résumé mensuel des observations météo ( températures minimales et maximales, précipitations et ensoleillement) de la station...

 

Does anyone think summer 2020 could end up like this? 
 

It wouldn’t surprise me if we get a poor summer month coming up. 

[B87]

45 minutes ago, Sunny76 said:

Does anyone think summer 2020 could end up like this? 
 

It wouldn’t surprise me if we get a poor summer month coming up. 

If we had a terrible summer month this year, it'll be August. 

It's usually the case to have anomalously bad Augusts these days. 

The last really bad Junes we had were in 2016, 2013 and 2012. Last bad Julys were 2012, 2011, 2008. Last really bad Augusts were in 2017, 2015, 2014.

Edited May 10, 2020 by B87