Novel Coronavirus – China

[Cheshire Freeze]

9 minutes ago, emax said:

It is strange though. Similar thing for me, my parents, several of my family, and god knows how many friends I know, all at or just before Christmas. Ending with a persistent cough that lasted for weeks on and off.

Now its very likely not this virus (would be nice if it was, everything could go back to normal then), but I even said at the time I've never known so many people to have a similar flu type within such a short space of time. And at least half the people I know who had it, didnt catch it from our "group", so it was already out there. Now dont get me wrong, there's plenty of cold and flu viruses that go around every year, it was just very odd that everyone got it at a similar time. Plus it seems there's plenty on here who've had it too. Definitely interesting, but probably just a very normal and popular flu bug doing the rounds, we shall see!

 

Yes, as I say, it was rife around here all at once for maybe 6-8 weeks or so then just seemed to die off.

Edited March 5, 2020 by CreweCold

[tinybill]

i see  the  usa  have a cruise  ship with possible virus  on boaded lets see how they mange with that  one,they havent a clue what they are doing at the  momemt it seems  to me  hardly testing any  one

[philglossop]

Well there was a vicious virus doing the rounds at work about 2 weeks ago, certainly I had it as did most of my team. Felt like flu, wiped us all out. Didnt have the cough but felt dreadful and ached all over.

However, this had a real sinus problem so guessing it wasnt. 

 

I'm trying to up my vitamins etc on the home to boost my immune system. 

[Tom Quintavalle]

Morning all,

Just wanted to say thanks to all that have contributed to this Thread.

I've found it much more informative than some of the "claptrap" reporting in other Media sources.

As I've stated on other Threads, my Wife is a Senior Carer in a Residential Care Home in Chislehurst, N.W.Kent/S.E.London border.

She is responsible for handing out Medication to the Residents and updating, their Care Plans. Obviously, if she gets their Medication wrong, she could do some serious damage to a Resident. As I'm sure you're all aware, Workers in the Care Industry, are paid a paltry sum. To add to the insult of this pitiful Salary, the Care Home Staff received a Christmas Box of a £5 Amazon Voucher (I kid you not, plus my Wife hasn't received hers yet).

The Manager of the Care Home was so disgusted and embarrassed by this, that she gave the 30 odd Staff, an extra £5 each, out of her own money. I didn't realise you could get an Amazon Voucher, in such low denominations!!

For this generous (not!) remuneration, the Staff are exposed to all manner of Viruses and Bugs. My Wife frequently "brings" home a bug.

Now the salient point of my Post, the Staff are not allowed to wear Face Masks, as it frightens the Residents.

My Wife told me that one of her colleagues, despite warnings of it being a Coronavirus "hotspot", recently had a Week in Thailand. I think that was very irresponsible and selfish. This individual has returned to Work, after her Holiday. I can't begin to imagine the carnage she would wreak on the Residents, if she has brought back the Coronavirus with her. The majority of the Residents are in their '70s, '80s and '90s, a lot with underlying health issues.

Now I know that cancelling a Holiday at very late notice can result in you losing all of your money. Back in the 1970's, I used to work for Cosmos Tours (Bromley,Kent), and remember Holiday goers cancelling their trips, due to an outbreak of Cholera, in the Naples area. Had to go into work on that Saturday, to handle all the Telephone enquiries.

I'm not sure what the Policy is with Travel Companies currently, in respect of the Coronavirus outbreak?

Back to the subject of Care Homes, again. The lack of acknowledgement and value (through wages and working conditions) given to Workers in the Care Industry, is a National disgrace IMO. I take my hat off to all of them, throughout the UK.

Chislehurst, N.W.Kent, is a very affluent area. The en suite Rooms, at this Care Home, cost the Resident £1,500 per Week. If the Resident doesn't have any savings, Bromley Social Services, "foot the bill".

So, someone is seeing that Money and it's certainly NOT the Care Home Staff Shame on you BUPA!!

Regards,

Tom.   

 

Edited March 5, 2020 by TomSE12

[Blessed Weather]

Just an observation, but I think we all need to be aware that the UK media are addicted to dramatic headlines to grab attention, even so called 'serious' publications like the Telegraph seem prone to this. Take this headline from yesterday's Telegraph and some of the first few sentences:

Coronavirus has mutated into more aggressive disease, say scientists

Coronavirus has mutated into two strains, one which appears to be far more aggressive, scientists have said, in a discovery which could hinder attempts to develop a vaccine. Researchers at Peking University's School of Life Sciences and the Institut Pasteur of Shanghai, discovered the virus has evolved into two major lineages - dubbed ‘L’ and ‘S’ types. The older ‘S-type’ appears to be milder and less infectious, while the ‘L-type’ which emerged later, spreads quickly and currently accounts for around 70 per cent of cases. 

Fairly dramatic stuff. But then when you read on, there is actually more positive news that shows they could have made the headline something like "Coronavirus may be mutating to less aggressive disease".

“It is usually the case that when RNA viruses first cross species barriers into humans they aren’t particularly well adapted to their new host - us!” said Dr Griffin. “Thus, they usually undergo some changes allowing them to adapt and become better able to replicate within, and spread from human-to-human.” Dr Griffin said developers would need to test whether their prototype vaccines would still neutralise viruses with the changes, but added that the variations were ‘fairly limited’ and may not be a ‘huge hurdle.’
The Chinese scientists, who analysed the viral DNA from 103 infected people, said it appeared the less dangerous ‘S-type’ was now taking over, possibly because of aggressive public health lockdown measures in China, which had stopped the more virulent disease in its tracks.
However Dr Bharat Pankhania, Senior Clinical Lecturer at the University of Exeter Medical School, said it was impossible to know what was causing the slowdown. “We don’t really know the true picture in China,” he said. “Is the lower number of cases a true reflection? It could be the virus mutating to a less dangerous form, or it could be the superhuman lockdown measures. “Or there could be a third reason which is genetic drift. RNA viruses are quite mistake-prone so over time they become not very good at replicating.”

So at the moment (and in my personal opinion) I think it's probably a good idea to adopt a questioning, maybe even cynical view of media headlines. Read the small print or dig deeper before forming a conclusion!

Source: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2020/03/04/coronavirus-has-mutated-aggressive-disease-say-scientists/

[I remember Atlantic 252]

212, my prediction by 10pm tonight, 556 tomorrow

[Weather-history]

Well coronavirus has killed off FlyBE

Toilet roll shortages in Australia because of panic buying.

Coronavirus: Man tasered by police after dispute in Big W store over toilet paper shortage

WWW.9NEWS.COM.AU

---

A NSW man has been tasered by police after getting into an argument over toilet paper at a Big W store.

Not sure what the panic is Down Under...

[Astral Goat Juice]

6 minutes ago, Weather-history said:

Well coronavirus has killed off FlyBE

Toilet roll shortages in Australia because of panic buying.

Coronavirus: Man tasered by police after dispute in Big W store over toilet paper shortage

WWW.9NEWS.COM.AU

---

A NSW man has been tasered by police after getting into an argument over toilet paper at a Big W store.

Not sure what the panic is Down Under...

I don't get the whole toilet roll thing. It's happening in the States too, panic buying of toilet roll. 

I'm pretty certain if it ever got the point where I needed to bug out, I'd be buying canned food, because I can't eat toilet roll.

[Azazel]

8 hours ago, Bristle boy said:

The expat from Wales, Conor Reed, who caught CV in late November has an exclusive account, in tomorrow's Daily Mail  of his fight against the disease.

What it's REALLY like to catch coronavirus: First British victim, 25, describes how 'worst disease he ever had' left him sweating, shivering, and struggling to breath as his eyes burned and bones ached 

- I cant get a link to work, so just google it.

His account is very scary. He is only in his mid-20s.

And interesting reading some comments on this story on Mailonline. A NHS nurse in "comments" recks she's been treating cases like his account since last Sept - really??!!

 

I don't buy his account.

I remember the daily mail ran an article on him a little while back too.

I think he was sick, sure - but the bunged up nose/sinus issues etc sound like a nasty cold which developed into bronchitis/pneumonia - he also says he was given antibiotics by the english doctors at the university after being diagnosed with pneumonia...and he decided not to take them. You have to be a special kind of stupid to do that. If you had been struggling to breathe for days, feeling on the cusp of death and your doctor gives you a course of antibiotics to treat your lung infection and make you feel better, you're going to start taking them immediately.

I dont know, his account feels embellished and dramatised to me. Lungs sounded like crumpled up paper bags? really??

[Azazel]

8 hours ago, Robbie Garrett said:

 

My symptoms were, a dry cough, aches in the body, fever, pain above the nose. But zero phlegm.   

This website traces back a strain being located in the UK (Respiratory Virus Unit, Microbiology Services Colindale, Public Health England) between the 13th and 23rd of January 2020.   I just looked at my Medical Records, went to doctors on 15th January. Was told I have a viral infection on that date.

"This phylogeny shows evolutionary relationships of HCoV-19 viruses from the ongoing novel coronavirus COVID-19 pandemic. All samples are still closely related with few mutations relative to a common ancestor, suggesting a shared common ancestor some time in Nov-Dec 2019. This indicates an initial human infection in Nov-Dec 2019 followed by sustained human-to-human transmission leading to sampled infections."

auspice

NEXTSTRAIN.ORG

Having looked at this, I am more convinced. 

 

Fascinating.

I keep flip-flopping between "no it was just the flu" to "yep, definitely had it."

Would be wonderful peace of mind to know I already had it to be honest. 

My symptoms match coronavirus perfectly - they also match the flu perfectly...apart from the day or so of breathlessness which is the one stark difference and only something that occurs with flu if you develop complications..

 

Very interesting.

Some good news - i actually have a course of steroids I was supposed to take to clear out my sinuses which I always have issues with, but I havent taken them yet. I think I am going to keep them on hand in-case I catch this thing.

[Astral Goat Juice]

That doesn't sound great now does it?

Quote

“The influence of COVID-19 on the human body is like a combination of SARS and AIDS as it damages both the lungs and immune systems,” Peng Zhiyong, director of the intensive care unit of the Zhongnan Hospital of Wuhan University in Wuhan, told the Global Times.

Coronavirus ‘like a combination of SARS and AIDS’

WWW.NEWS.COM.AU

---

Chinese doctors say autopsies of coronavirus victims suggest the deadly illness is “like a combination of SARS and AIDS” that can cause “irreversible” lung...

 

[Azazel]

8 hours ago, Robbie Garrett said:

 

My symptoms were, a dry cough, aches in the body, fever, pain above the nose. But zero phlegm.   

This website traces back a strain being located in the UK (Respiratory Virus Unit, Microbiology Services Colindale, Public Health England) between the 13th and 23rd of January 2020.   I just looked at my Medical Records, went to doctors on 15th January. Was told I have a viral infection on that date.

"This phylogeny shows evolutionary relationships of HCoV-19 viruses from the ongoing novel coronavirus COVID-19 pandemic. All samples are still closely related with few mutations relative to a common ancestor, suggesting a shared common ancestor some time in Nov-Dec 2019. This indicates an initial human infection in Nov-Dec 2019 followed by sustained human-to-human transmission leading to sampled infections."

auspice

NEXTSTRAIN.ORG

Having looked at this, I am more convinced. 

 

Sorry to quote this again, but I'm not very good at interpreting the data on that site.

Am I correct in saying they tested a strain of Covid found in the UK between the 13th and 23rd of January 2020 and after studying it saw that it's lineage goes back to sometime in November? Suggesting this thing has been in the UK since November?

 

Sorry if that sounds stupid haha but that's what I got from it.

[DAVID SNOW]

13 minutes ago, Astral Goat Juice said:

That doesn't sound great now does it?

Coronavirus ‘like a combination of SARS and AIDS’

WWW.NEWS.COM.AU

---

Chinese doctors say autopsies of coronavirus victims suggest the deadly illness is “like a combination of SARS and AIDS” that can cause “irreversible” lung...

 

Heavy smokers for years?

Breathing in very polluted air for years?

[Snipper]

1 hour ago, TomSE12 said:

 

Back to the subject of Care Homes, again. The lack of acknowledgement and value (through wages and working conditions) given to Workers in the Care Industry, is a National disgrace IMO. I take my hat off to all of them, throughout the UK.

 

Agree. Any one who can put up with dealing with my mother needs rewarding.

Seems a pity that those who have some savings pay more than the local authority cough up. All rather inequitable.

[Snipper]

26 minutes ago, Astral Goat Juice said:

I don't get the whole toilet roll thing. It's happening in the States too, panic buying of toilet roll. 

I'm pretty certain if it ever got the point where I needed to bug out, I'd be buying canned food, because I can't eat toilet roll.

It is eat with your right hand and wipe your bottom with your left isn’t it?  Must try and remember. 

[Methuselah]

9 hours ago, Bristle boy said:

Maybe it affected his memory

Or fattened his wallet?

[Methuselah]

2 hours ago, philglossop said:

Well there was a vicious virus doing the rounds at work about 2 weeks ago, certainly I had it as did most of my team. Felt like flu, wiped us all out. Didnt have the cough but felt dreadful and ached all over.

However, this had a real sinus problem so guessing it wasnt. 

 

I'm trying to up my vitamins etc on the home to boost my immune system. 

Only just getting over that one, myself, Phil...It's hung around for the best part of four weeks!

[Robbie Garrett]

10 minutes ago, Azazel said:

Sorry to quote this again, but I'm not very good at interpreting the data on that site.

Am I correct in saying they tested a strain of Covid found in the UK between the 13th and 23rd of January 2020 and after studying it saw that it's lineage goes back to sometime in November? Suggesting this thing has been in the UK since November?

 

Sorry if that sounds stupid haha but that's what I got from it.

I believe the initial strains from Wahun were later linked to further cases elsewhere.   UK shows to have had strains of the virus then,  then if you look properly then spread elsewhere.

 

Science huh..

Edited March 5, 2020 by Robbie Garrett

[ciel]

The link below was posted here several pages back and might go some way to dispel any notion that the elderly might be responsible for the spread of the illness.

The majority of confirmed cases were in the age group 30yr - 69yr.

Of course, the impact of the illness has greater impact on the 70yr + age group.

• China: age distribution of novel coronavirus patients 2020 | Statista

WWW.STATISTA.COM

---

According to a medical analysis based on 44,672 confirmed cases of the novel coronavirus COVID-19 in China published in February 2020, most patients aged...

 

[Methuselah]

1 hour ago, Blessed Weather said:

Just an observation, but I think we all need to be aware that the UK media are addicted to dramatic headlines to grab attention, even so called 'serious' publications like the Telegraph seem prone to this. Take this headline from yesterday's Telegraph and some of the first few sentences:

Coronavirus has mutated into more aggressive disease, say scientists

Coronavirus has mutated into two strains, one which appears to be far more aggressive, scientists have said, in a discovery which could hinder attempts to develop a vaccine. Researchers at Peking University's School of Life Sciences and the Institut Pasteur of Shanghai, discovered the virus has evolved into two major lineages - dubbed ‘L’ and ‘S’ types. The older ‘S-type’ appears to be milder and less infectious, while the ‘L-type’ which emerged later, spreads quickly and currently accounts for around 70 per cent of cases. 

Fairly dramatic stuff. But then when you read on, there is actually more positive news that shows they could have made the headline something like "Coronavirus may be mutating to less aggressive disease".

“It is usually the case that when RNA viruses first cross species barriers into humans they aren’t particularly well adapted to their new host - us!” said Dr Griffin. “Thus, they usually undergo some changes allowing them to adapt and become better able to replicate within, and spread from human-to-human.” Dr Griffin said developers would need to test whether their prototype vaccines would still neutralise viruses with the changes, but added that the variations were ‘fairly limited’ and may not be a ‘huge hurdle.’
The Chinese scientists, who analysed the viral DNA from 103 infected people, said it appeared the less dangerous ‘S-type’ was now taking over, possibly because of aggressive public health lockdown measures in China, which had stopped the more virulent disease in its tracks.
However Dr Bharat Pankhania, Senior Clinical Lecturer at the University of Exeter Medical School, said it was impossible to know what was causing the slowdown. “We don’t really know the true picture in China,” he said. “Is the lower number of cases a true reflection? It could be the virus mutating to a less dangerous form, or it could be the superhuman lockdown measures. “Or there could be a third reason which is genetic drift. RNA viruses are quite mistake-prone so over time they become not very good at replicating.”

So at the moment (and in my personal opinion) I think it's probably a good idea to adopt a questioning, maybe even cynical view of media headlines. Read the small print or dig deeper before forming a conclusion!

Source: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2020/03/04/coronavirus-has-mutated-aggressive-disease-say-scientists/

How sad that a once-great daily newspaper has sunk so low. Whenever I wanted to see things from a different perspective to my own, I'd usually turn to the Telegraph. Not any more!

[Azazel]

May be of no interest but here are some screenshots of my conversations with my mum and friend at the time (mum's name blanked out to stop any of you crazy cats stalking her :p)

[Summer Sun]

 

[nick sussex]

Looks like the policy to not tell people locations of new cases for a week might be shelved .

I really don’t buy the excuse that allegedly with so many new cases that it was technically difficult .

I take it the health minister didn’t fall into some space time continuum which took him back to pre computer/internet days !

 

[Summer Sun]

England’s Six Nations game against Italy on March 14th in Rome has been postponed due to the coronavirus outbreak.

[nick sussex]

1 minute ago, Summer Sun said:

England’s Six Nations game against Italy on March 14th in Rome has been postponed due to the coronavirus outbreak.

I thought it was going to be played behind closed doors .