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Are badger culls working and are they humane?

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Professor Munro the ex-Chair of an independent expert group thinks not

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Up to 9,000 of badgers are likely to have suffered "immense pain" in culls to control cattle TB, according to a former government adviser.

Prof Ranald Munro is the ex-Chair of an independent expert group appointed by the government to assess its trials.

He has written to Natural England to say that the policy is causing "huge suffering".

He adds that the culls are not reducing TB in cattle and in one area the incidence of the disease has gone up.

The culls began in 2012 following appeals from cattle farmers whose livelihoods are continuing to be damaged by the spread of TB.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-49611457

Edited by knocker

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Nope,  terrible destruction of wildlife without solid evidence it appears.  I know they are destructuve little critters but causing this suffering is awful.  I've had badger families in and aroundmy  garden ever since I lived here, 20 years.  I did have to ban them from the garden a couple of years ago because of the damage they do digging but it is so upsetting to see them destroyed in this way.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/oct/21/badger-cull-success-claim-attacked-experts

Haven't searched for evidence as it depresses me to read about all this destruction but I feel I did read some research once that suggested vaccinating badgers, however impractical it may seem, against TB works.  

It seems to be just a further example, if ever we needed one, of MP's/government officials/parliament believing what they want to believe or what is convenient to them rather than facing up to truths/evidence of the matter.

It seems the country has gone mad 🙄

 

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It's a mischievous survey which appears to be based on the time a shot was fired to the time the death of badger is confirmed, which can be several minutes due to difficult terrain and the hunter having to put on a decontamination suit so as not to catch TB himself - since the majority of them are carrying it.
Perhaps they will do a survey on the suffering of hundreds of cattle killed along with unborn calves, which have become reactors due to infected badgers piddling on their grazing, or how about stress and injuries to farmers and vets from repeated testing of cattle.
BBC bias at its finest.  

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Its a vicious circle this TB literally.

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our local wildlife trust vaccinates badgers so there no need for a cull.

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The vaccination has to repeated annually, not remotely practical away from a limited reserve.
 

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On 09/09/2019 at 08:08, Snowycat said:

  I know they are destructuve little critters but causing this suffering is awful.  I've had badger families in and aroundmy  garden ever since I lived here, 20 years.  I did have to ban them from the garden a couple of years ago because of the damage they do digging but it is so upsetting to see them destroyed in this way.

Yes my experience is they can be a horrendous problem. Apart from them deciding to re landscape your garden I had cases where garden sheds had their bases destroyed. Had another client who had a small industrial building on slab foundations. Mr Badger and his chums undermined the foundations causing structural damage. Had the job of finding another site where a sett could be constructed and the badgers relocated. Took ages to achieve and cost tens of thousands of pounds. 

Personally I don’t like them particularly when they take up residence in an urban area. 

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Isn't it that our gardens are in the wrong places? I work with all my beasts and mini-beasts and try to garden organically - it hurts like hell (oops forgot we are at primary school and can't use adult mild swear words - would have put merde) at times but it works. I mistook digging in my lettuces to be cats, but it was hedgehogs, desperate for moisture. A shallow bowl of water and some Mylo food and we had wildlife cam evidence of success and no further disturbance. We have badgers at the lake, foxes and deer too

I'd recommend luring the badgers away with water and food. They are omnivores, so some cooked chicken (not bones, don't even think of leaving them for foxes either - what we wouldn't give our doggies, we don't give our wildies). Peanuts in a trough of soil works for photos which is what we have done. It might take a few weeks but they'll soon hunt beyond your garden. Also, make sure you are not inadvertantly attracting them with anything - barbecue leftovers, kid's detritus, bin bags etc.

Remember badgers will eat your mice and small rats and do some cleanings of other crap too.

Stay kind...

Edited by Spikecollie

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1 hour ago, Spikecollie said:

Isn't it that our gardens are in the wrong places? I work with all my beasts and mini-beasts and try to garden organically - it hurts like hell (oops forgot we are at primary school and can't use adult mild swear words - would have put merde) at times but it works. I mistook digging in my lettuces to be cats, but it was hedgehogs, desperate for moisture. A shallow bowl of water and some Mylo food and we had wildlife cam evidence of success and no further disturbance. We have badgers at the lake, foxes and deer too

I'd recommend luring the badgers away with water and food. They are omnivores, so some cooked chicken (not bones, don't even think of leaving them for foxes either - what we wouldn't give our doggies, we don't give our wildies). Peanuts in a trough of soil works for photos which is what we have done. It might take a few weeks but they'll soon hunt beyond your garden. Also, make sure you are not inadvertantly attracting them with anything - barbecue leftovers, kid's detritus, bin bags etc.

Remember badgers will eat your mice and small rats and do some cleanings of other crap too.

Stay kind...

Oh for goodness sake they can be a complete nightmare. They might eat the odd mouse but that is a complete sideline to trashing your garden. Have you actually seen the damage they can do? 

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As for hedge hogs badgers find them a tasty treat. 

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1 hour ago, Snipper said:

As for hedge hogs badgers find them a tasty treat. 

I know. I'm happy to let MN take her course.

A bit like tonight when MN has bestowed me with an absolutley stinking/stonking late summer cold of the cannot function variety. Going to bed before I collapse on the floor...

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like them or not, they are a part of the british countryside and have every right to be there, if anything needs culling, its the more destructive creatures who think they own it all, the bipeds, us.

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Your signature says it all. Life is to be lived.

We are the villains here, thinking we own the (merde-ing planet - I swear in French to avoid the childish NW filter and I live here!)

I'll try and post my wildlfecam photos of my badgers after this

We stay in our tent at our land which is a wildlife refuge - nothing better than something rustling behind the tent in the middle of the night! We do have to manage things though and getting rid of the Coypu (look them up) took time. All were eaten by all three of us and detritus went to the foxes - I hand fed a babe which went on to be big as I marked him/her by cutting ear fur. 

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On 14/09/2019 at 09:20, mushymanrob said:

like them or not, they are a part of the british countryside and have every right to be there, if anything needs culling, its the more destructive creatures who think they own it all, the bipeds, us.

Yes but not urban streets. 

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20 hours ago, Snipper said:

Yes but not urban streets. 

............. that were once countryside... whos land is it anyway?..

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4 hours ago, mushymanrob said:

............. that were once countryside... whos land is it anyway?..

Oh so tiresome. Ok let us humans kill ourselves off. If most did so it would solve an awful lot of problems.  Do you suggest an alternative?  Ok what are you personally doing to balance the odds?

 

Edited by Snipper

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14 hours ago, Snipper said:

Oh so tiresome. Ok let us humans kill ourselves off. If most did so it would solve an awful lot of problems.  Do you suggest an alternative?  Ok what are you personally doing to balance the odds?

 

thats daft..... surely a sensible compromise can be sorted so both can live side by side..... common sense.

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16 minutes ago, mushymanrob said:

thats daft..... surely a sensible compromise can be sorted so both can live side by side..... common sense.

Yes common sense but history doesn’t make me optimistic. 

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How much would it cost (in relation to what raising cattle costs already) to inoculate the entire herd against TB?

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22 hours ago, Ed Stone said:

How much would it cost (in relation to what raising cattle costs already) to inoculate the entire herd against TB?

not a clue, but the cost of culling badgers and loss to farmers of infected stock must be quite high. maybe a nationwide inoculation program would be the most sensible way to go. after all, we will never kill all badgers, nor should we.

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23 hours ago, Ed Stone said:

How much would it cost (in relation to what raising cattle costs already) to inoculate the entire herd against TB?

I'm not sure about this, but I understand the problem of vaccinating cattle is not so much the cost but that it can lead to false positive results when a herd is tested for the disease.

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On 09/09/2019 at 10:45, 4wd said:

It's a mischievous survey which appears to be based on the time a shot was fired to the time the death of badger is confirmed, which can be several minutes due to difficult terrain and the hunter having to put on a decontamination suit so as not to catch TB himself - since the majority of them are carrying it.
Perhaps they will do a survey on the suffering of hundreds of cattle killed along with unborn calves, which have become reactors due to infected badgers piddling on their grazing, or how about stress and injuries to farmers and vets from repeated testing of cattle.
BBC bias at its finest.  

Do animals being culled suffer then? If so, then animals being sent to slaughter must also suffer...

What do you think about the reports of farms with VERY strict bio-security and no TB? Do you think strict bio-security can control TB?

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8 hours ago, Devonian said:

Do animals being culled suffer then? If so, then animals being sent to slaughter must also suffer...

What do you think about the reports of farms with VERY strict bio-security and no TB? Do you think strict bio-security can control TB?

Depends what strict bio security involves. 

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