Worst summer of the 1980s?

[hillbilly]

It was obviously different in the north west than it is in Norfolk.It is also differently perceived on what you class is poor.Just because the temperature is cooler does not bean it is poor and it can be very wet on several days but is that worse than less rain but on far more days.Certainly 2012 was worse than any summer here in the 80s but not comparative months may not have been.

[Weather-history]

Talk about summer of 1986, how many people realise that over a 1/5 of summer's 1986 rainfall total for England and Wales was contributed by the remains of Charley? 

Overall, summer 1986 was not a wet summer. 

 

[Weather-history]

16 minutes ago, Weather-history said:

Talk about summer of 1986, how many people realise that over a 1/5 of summer's 1986 rainfall total for England and Wales was contributed by the remains of Charley? 

Overall, summer 1986 was not a wet summer. 

 

York after the remains of Charley had struck, the river Ouse had burst its banks

[mushymanrob]

53 minutes ago, Weather-history said:

2012 is the worst summer I have experienced and I experienced those poor summers of 1985-88. 

i agree..... those mid 80's summers were not as relentlessly wet, no summer flooding like we had in 2012. .... well not as bad...

Edited August 14, 2018 by mushymanrob

[Snowyowl9]

36 minutes ago, mushymanrob said:

i agree..... those mid 80's summers were not as relentlessly wet, no summer flooding like we had in 2012. .... well not as bad...

You only need to check this site for the record flooding of that strange period from 2007.

 Worst summer flooding in living memory.exceptional flooding

http://www.trevorharley.com/weather_web_pages/2007_weather.htm

Going back to july 1980 that was pretty cold going back to the 80`s.

 

[Relativistic]

4 hours ago, reef said:

You can't really say they were just as cool "if you take out these few days". The point is, in the past there weren't as many "these such days". It doesn't change anything at the end of the day, they are still seen as rotten summers. However, the fact is that although they are cool by recent standards, they don't compare to past summers. Another fine example is the 1960s: seven summers of that decade were cooler than 2012 and only 6 out of 30 of the summer months were above 15.5C on CET. Wet or dry, that would surely have people up in arms these days!

I don't disagree with anything you've said, but I think you've missed my point somewhat. Apologies for not making myself clear.

My point was about people's perceptions. Someone on here commented that people nowadays would really have struggled in the aforementioned 1980s Summers given that the overall temperatures were that much lower. My point about the short strings of days that skewed the overall figures in the cases I mentioned was that the monthly statistics are not representative of people's perceptions of how the months actually were. When most people judge a particular month or season they will do so based on the dominant theme, and not on the few oddball days that were different. Based on CET figures, June 1985, for example, was cool from start to finish. But the actual daily means were comparable to those of June 2012, barring the hotter days that the latter saw towards the end. Thus, when people compare the two months, their perceptions of temperature may well be very similar, despite the disparity in the monthly figures.

Don't get me wrong, in most scenarios I'd quote the monthly figures. But the comparisons that people are making on here seem largely to be based on their subjective experiences.

Edited August 14, 2018 by Relativistic

[Sunny76]

I’m 42 Frozen. I remember the mid 80s as being cold, but 2012 was appalling. I think a wetter summer is worse than a drier colder one. 

[Thundery wintry showers]

I wasn't old enough to appreciate the 1980s summers (born in 1984).  I can hazard some guesses based on the stats though. 

For South Tyneside my guess would be 1987.  1980 and 1985 are the other main contenders, but 1980 might have been saved by an unusually thundery June and 1985 by having three moderately poor months rather than any standout stinkers.  The region got off lightly relative to most other parts of the country in summer 1988, and 1986 had a decent June.

For the Exeter area I guess the main candidates are 1980, 1986 and 1988.  Judging by the Met Office's Monthly Weather Reports, 1980 was probably consistently poor (although again with the caveat about the thundery June), and 1986 and 1988 had fairly dry and warm but cloudy Junes, and generally dull wet weather through high summer - in particular the stats suggest that August 1986 and July 1988 were washouts down here.

Edited August 15, 2018 by Thundery wintry showers

[cheeky_monkey]

On 15/08/2018 at 16:42, Thundery wintry showers said:

 

For the Exeter area I guess the main candidates are 1980, 1986 and 1988.  Judging by the Met Office's Monthly Weather Reports, 1980 was probably consistently poor (although again with the caveat about the thundery June), and 1986 and 1988 had fairly dry and warm but cloudy Junes, and generally dull wet weather through high summer - in particular the stats suggest that August 1986 and July 1988 were washouts down here.

i was living in Exeter in 1980 and 1986..i think i picked 1986 as the worst summer of the 1980s...in 1988 i was living in Chelmsford.

[Badgers01]

The fact we have so much choice says something about the 80s summers - they were quite polarising with the poor ones contrasted against 83,84&89. ‘88 was especially during the school holidays and being the 4th below par in a row stands out. 

[Weather-history]

1981 is an interesting one. CET,  it was on the coolish side but it was  dry for England and Wales. It's the 19th driest summer on record. Drier than 1947, 1959, 1989, 2003, 2006

[Wherestherain]

Where I lived, which was Lanarkshire in Scotland,, I seem to remember summer 1986 as being dry and warm to hot, as well as 1983 and 84. 88 and 89 were dull here. 1990 was a scorcher! 

[chubbyfan]

1986 august bank holiday had the remains of hurricane charlie across southern england at least. v stormy, cold, horizontal rain, and many a leaf did tremble.

lol..i just googled it and was surprised to see a page about it on wiki, more widespead than s england then..

Edited July 20, 2021 by chubbyfan

[Sunny76]

3 hours ago, chubbyfan said:

1986 august bank holiday had the remains of hurricane charlie across southern england at least. v stormy, cold, horizontal rain, and many a leaf did tremble.

lol..i just googled it and was surprised to see a page about it on wiki, more widespead than s england then..

I remember late 1986, as a 10 year old. It was bloody cold and wet.

That thunderstorm from Wimbledon 1985 looks pretty severe. Reminds me of the May 2018 storm we got in West London.

[damianslaw]

Statistically I think 1985 was the coolest overall.. 

There was a terrible 4 year run between 1985-88 not good for a 7-10 year old who wanted to be outside. My memories are of the school holiday periods being wet most of the time. 1988 was a shocker for rain during school holiday period. I think 1986 had some fair conditions at times more so earlier on in the summer. 1987 just consistently cool and wet from memory. 1985 memory more distant but stats show it was a very poor one.

The period was book ended by 2 excellent summers here in 1984 and 1989. Best of the bunch. 1983 produced a great July.

[Sunny76]

2 minutes ago, damianslaw said:

Statistically I think 1985 was the coolest overall.. 

There was a terrible 4 year run between 1985-88 not good for a 7-10 year old who wanted to be outside. My memories are of the school holiday periods being wet most of the time. 1988 was a shocker for rain during school holiday period. I think 1986 had some fair conditions at times more so earlier on in the summer. 1987 just consistently cool and wet from memory. 1985 memory more distant but stats show it was a very poor one.

The period was book ended by 2 excellent summers here in 1984 and 1989. Best of the bunch. 1983 produced a great July.

I was between 9-12 during the 85-88 period. I seem to recall there being at least one or two hot humid spells during each of those summers, although they were short lived.

Remember July 85, and maybe early August having some warm sunny or hot weather for a time. 86 was warm for a time during the World Cup, but August was dreadful.

1987 was very wet in June, we had some hot days in early July, before it turned thundery in the second half of the month. I remember it being quite unsettled with thunderstorms in london during the early school holidays. And finally, the last week or so of August 87 was hot, with storms on the Friday night, and also during Saturday.

 

88 was forgettable.

[Optimus Prime]

Table showing average maximum, rainfall and sunshine for June, July and August against the 1951-80 avg

Clearly 1985 is the worst. 

 

[damianslaw]

39 minutes ago, Optimus Prime said:

Table showing average maximum, rainfall and sunshine for June, July and August against the 1951-80 avg

Clearly 1985 is the worst. 

 

Backs up my comment. 1985 coldest, also wettest, oddly though the sunniest.

 1987 dullest.

1986 best of the four, warmest, driest and nearly sunniest, but overall poor.

Do you have stats for other summers. I suspect 1989 warmest, sunniest and driest, though 84 might give it a run for its money. I think it was better in the west than the south and east, whereas 1989 brought widespread good conditions.

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by damianslaw

[cheeky_monkey]

45 minutes ago, damianslaw said:

Backs up my comment. 1985 coldest, also wettest, oddly though the sunniest.

 1987 dullest.

1986 best of the four, warmest, driest and nearly sunniest, but overall poor.

Do you have stats for other summers. I suspect 1989 warmest, sunniest and driest, though 84 might give it a run for its money. I think it was better in the west than the south and east, whereas 1989 brought widespread good conditions.

 

1983 was the warmest summer of the decade with an average of 17.1c..followed by 1989 at 16.5c and 1984 at 16.3c

[virtualsphere]

Although my memories of the 1980s are a bit sketchy being a child at the time, I remember some fairly dry but rather chilly weather on a 3 week holiday to Scotland in August 1987 (I have a photo taken in a duffle coat with shorts at John O'Groats).  I spent a lot of time outdoors so I'm sure I'd remember if any had been as consistently wet as 2012 here.

These show 1985 as the wettest of the period, on a par with 2007 but not as wet as 2012:

 

1987 as the dullest, on a par with 2012 and less sunny than 2007 or 2008:

 

Interestingly 1989 comes in sunnier than 2018 and everything else since 1995.

Temperature is where the 1980s summers fall back, we've not had anything colder than that run of late 80s summers since in terms of mean temperature although looking slightly further back they weren't quite as cold as some of the summers in the 50s and 60s.  Our recent poor summers don't fare as badly in that respect (if it's heat you like: I'm finding this week a bit too warm!)

 

UK temperature, rainfall and sunshine time series

WWW.METOFFICE.GOV.UK

---

Time series graphs of climate variables for previous months, seasons and years

 

[Optimus Prime]

1 hour ago, damianslaw said:

Backs up my comment. 1985 coldest, also wettest, oddly though the sunniest.

 1987 dullest.

1986 best of the four, warmest, driest and nearly sunniest, but overall poor.

Do you have stats for other summers. I suspect 1989 warmest, sunniest and driest, though 84 might give it a run for its money. I think it was better in the west than the south and east, whereas 1989 brought widespread good conditions.

 

1989 was a great summer. 

Also included 1963 (reference period 1931 - 1960) certainly a poor summer overall with August being particularly cool (18.1 °C, equal with 1985 but nowhere near as bad as 1986's 17.4 °C). Interestingly, the warm June's of the 60's were just 0.1 °C cooler than August's of the same period in terms of mean maximum.. June 1960 maximum was outstandingly warm, last time we had one warmer was 1976.

Interestingly, the period 1931 - 1960 was warmer (by day), drier and sunnier than the period 1951 - 1980 in terms of the summer.

 

[damianslaw]

1 hour ago, cheeky_monkey said:

1983 was the warmest summer of the decade with an average of 17.1c..followed by 1989 at 16.5c and 1984 at 16.3c

Are these figures for a particular place. There is a post saying 21.6 for 1989 so I'm a little confused... 

[damianslaw]

1 hour ago, virtualsphere said:

Although my memories of the 1980s are a bit sketchy being a child at the time, I remember some fairly dry but rather chilly weather on a 3 week holiday to Scotland in August 1987 (I have a photo taken in a duffle coat with shorts at John O'Groats).  I spent a lot of time outdoors so I'm sure I'd remember if any had been as consistently wet as 2012 here.

These show 1985 as the wettest of the period, on a par with 2007 but not as wet as 2012:

 

1987 as the dullest, on a par with 2012 and less sunny than 2007 or 2008:

 

Interestingly 1989 comes in sunnier than 2018 and everything else since 1995.

Temperature is where the 1980s summers fall back, we've not had anything colder than that run of late 80s summers since in terms of mean temperature although looking slightly further back they weren't quite as cold as some of the summers in the 50s and 60s.  Our recent poor summers don't fare as badly in that respect (if it's heat you like: I'm finding this week a bit too warm!)

 

UK temperature, rainfall and sunshine time series

WWW.METOFFICE.GOV.UK

---

Time series graphs of climate variables for previous months, seasons and years

 

Interesting viewing, shows 2018 warmest along with 2006, followed closely by 2003, then 1976, then 1995.. these are average values, there will be local differences, here 1995 edges 1976 just, followed by 2018.

[cheeky_monkey]

21 minutes ago, damianslaw said:

Are these figures for a particular place. There is a post saying 21.6 for 1989 so I'm a little confused... 

met office CET figures 

[Thundery wintry showers]

The assessment of the Manchester stats illustrates some of the subjectivity that goes into best/worst. 

3 hours ago, Optimus Prime said:

Table showing average maximum, rainfall and sunshine for June, July and August against the 1951-80 avg

Clearly 1985 is the worst. 

 

I guess this is an example of where best/worst is subjective to some extent even if you're working from the premise that warmest/driest/sunniest = best.  When I read those stats, I assessed 1987 as "worst" because I gave more weight to sunshine than temperature and rainfall (1985 was coolest and wettest, but sunshine was surprisingly just a little below average).

I've checked out the 1980s summer stats for Waddington near Lincoln, and get the following: (anomalies/percent relative to 1951-80 average):

1980:  Tmax -0.9, rainfall 147, sunshine 83

1981: Tmax -0.1, rainfall 71, sunshine 96

1982: Tmax +0.5, rainfall 139, sunshine 89

1983: Tmax +2.0, rainfall 56, sunshine 112

1984: Tmax +1.3, rainfall 76, sunshine 118

1985: Tmax -1.2, rainfall 112, sunshine 96

1986: Tmax -0.5, rainfall 93, sunshine 105

1987: Tmax -1.2, rainfall 137, sunshine 77

1988: Tmax -0.7, rainfall 123, sunshine 93

1989: Tmax +2.1, rainfall 79, sunshine 138

Thus I'd say depending on what weights you give to maximum temperature, sunshine and rainfall, "worst" would be either 1980 or 1987.  It was surprising to see that 1986 came out slightly drier and sunnier than average.  1981 was drier than average here too, albeit marginally cooler/cloudier than average.