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stewfox

Libya migrants

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I appreciate their mainly non Libyans but what should one do ?

 

Hundreds of migrants believed to have drowned off Libya after boat capsizes

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/14/400-drowned-libya-italy-migrant-boat-capsizes

 

http://www.redressonline.com/2015/03/from-libya-to-italy-in-search-of-freedom/

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I'm not sure I'd want this group of murderers in my country - why have they not been repatriated rather than being arrested?

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/muslim-migrants-accused-of-throwing-christians-overboard-during-row-on-boat-from-libya-to-italy-10184025.html

 

What are the odds that most have Calais as a destination.

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We can't let people in Europe illegally because all amnesties ever do is promote even more illegal immigration because they know they won't be sent back. Firstly I think the rescue efforts are a disgrace. A lot more effort should be put into identifying these boats as early as possible and a lot more rescue boats should be patrolling the sea to be at the ready if a boat is sinking. But once rescued/identfied, the boats should be sent back safely across the Mediterranean.

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A problem we have is the enormous inequality between the developed world and the developing nations and for the latter to develop they need properly supervised and targeted aid to enable them to catch up with the long term aim being to achieve an environment whereby many of those risking life and limb to cross the Med in leaky boats would more likely prefer to remain in their home countries with their friends, family and sunshine. i.e. this can be done along the lines of the saying, give a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach him how to fish and he will be able to feed himself for a lifetime.

 

There are a lot of obstacles in the way of this, mainly political, religious, culture and war but this should not prevent the developed world from developing more realistic action to help these people - to wait until the next disaster then ship over tons of grain to alleviate famine is not really helping in the long term - what we should be doing is to develop and teach methods of water conservation with more efficient means of agriculture etc so that in the first place the people will be able to feed themselves and also introduce renewable energy systems. This is already being done to extent but a lot of these are by charities and because of limited resources, piecemeal.

 

It's all very well for certain right wing politicians to complain bitterly about the amount of immigration into this country and in the same breath advocate the reduction of overseas aid but in my view, with this attitude they will neither make substantial inroads into reducing this immigration, nor will they improve the lot of those driven by desperation to embark on such perilous journeys.

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This is net result of the West destabilizing Libya so we do have responsibility towards these people. However it's also a method of ISIS of spreading their hate to Europe. Although now being hushed up by the press it's probably these people who did the murdering. We will have to be very careful how we filter these people and being political correct is our weakest point so I would expect a lot to get through. At the moment Governments away from Italy are using the turn the other eye approach to the problem.

Unfortunately the destabilized nature of Libya makes it very difficult to help the civilian population. They are so many different factions it will be extremely long time before anyone gets control across the whole country. So the emigration will continue amongst these will be legit people and amongst them terrorists who's sole purpose is to destabilize the EU. Good luck in finding all them.

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We here in Britain should do nothing. Italy is more or less as developed as the UK, they should be able to cope.

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We here in Britain should do nothing. Italy is more or less as developed as the UK, they should be able to cope.

Think of bulls in a field and what they deposit.

We created the problem Italy didn't why shouldn't we take some responsibility.

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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3044584/Pray-Allah-ll-throw-overboard-Muslims-ordered-Christians-punctured-dinghy-African-migrants-sank-Mediterranean.html

 

Muslim migrants threw 12 Christians overboard to their deaths because they were not praying to Allah when they asked God for help when their dinghy suffered a puncture

 

I am all for rescuing these people if we send them back to the country their are from, But imagine people like that on the streets of the UK....

 

Not all r like that but why take the chances? We give enough to the EU surely their can spend a few million of r daily contribution to do something about this in fact if their did the problem would be solved 

 

I don't see why we should pay anything to this not r problem, We pay enough to the EU Italy needs help let the EU pay for it 

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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3044584/Pray-Allah-ll-throw-overboard-Muslims-ordered-Christians-punctured-dinghy-African-migrants-sank-Mediterranean.html

 

Muslim migrants threw 12 Christians overboard to their deaths because they were not praying to Allah when they asked God for help when their dinghy suffered a puncture

 

I am all for rescuing these people if we send them back to the country their are from, But imagine people like that on the streets of the UK....

 

Not all r like that but why take the chances? We give enough to the EU surely their can spend a few million of r daily contribution to do something about this in fact if their did the problem would be solved 

 

I don't see why we should pay anything to this not r problem, We pay enough to the EU Italy needs help let the EU pay for it 

They get sent down for murder. I noticed this has been removed from Beeb web site for some reason.

I suspect those who did that were Isis based hard liners who will be on some of these boats for obvious reasons.

However the innocent Muslims where should they flee to when the west went on a moral crusade and then ran away????

This is a question for those who promoted the backing of the rebels.

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Of course the vast majority aren't Libyans. Who can blame them for trying to make it to Europe? At the same time, whilst I think we have a moral obligation to save them from drowning where possible, that must be where our responsibility ends & they should not be allowed to settle here & should be returned.

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Another boat has capsized.

This cannot go on. The EU/NATO need to something from a humanitarian viewpoint.

Certainly some kind of military patrol of the Libyan coast with these boats being caught before they leave.

Cameron promised Libyans he would help rebuild their country. More lies.

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Another boat has capsized.

This cannot go on. The EU/NATO need to something from a humanitarian viewpoint.

Certainly some kind of military patrol of the Libyan coast with these boats being caught before they leave.

Cameron promised Libyans he would help rebuild their country. More lies.

 

Yes up to 700 feared dead.

 

We just have to rescue them and dropped them back on the beach where they came from.

 

I understand that wouldn't be easy.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/19/700-migrants-feared-dead-mediterranean-shipwreck-worst-yet

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We here in Britain should do nothing. Italy is more or less as developed as the UK, they should be able to cope.

This is not just an Italian problem, or just a UK problem for that matter - it is a European problem which requires a European answer.

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This is not just an Italian problem, or just a UK problem for that matter - it is a European problem which requires a European answer.

It is a southern European problem, if needs be we can help police the Med but the UK is not the worlds safe house.

Unfortunately this won't stop as long as people believe the Middle East has a right to self determination.

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It is a southern European problem, if needs be we can help police the Med but the UK is not the worlds safe house.

Unfortunately this won't stop as long as people believe the Middle East has a right to self determination.

OK, let's say we manage to effectively seal off the Med, then there are further routes via the eastern EU states who will manage their borders with varying degrees of efficiency and possibly not necessarily because of a lack of will but because they simply do not have the resources.

 

I say again it is a European problem.

 

What we really need is a unified European border force, properly equipped with boots on the ground, vehicles, aircraft and ships assisted with bespoke satellites with every state contributing man power and funds developing such a force to a high level of efficiency.

 

Of course we are partly responsible for being over generous but as I said before the developed west needs to invest properly and wisely in these sections of the Middle East to encourage development to the degree that people will no longer want to forsake the sunny climes of their homelands to live in rain sodden Blighty.

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I say its a direct result and consequence of the west meddling in who they think should lead these countries. It doesn't matter where you look but if the west has been there its a mess.

 

Lets not just confine this to a European problem, lets have a bit of responsible from our cousins across the pond too!   

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Indeed it's not just a European problem as the major problem is lies with the Islamic countries. Agreed the west hasn't covered itself in glory in North Africa, the Middle East and elsewhere but to continuously cast the blame in that direction is a cop out and pretty lazy thinking.

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I say its a direct result and consequence of the west meddling in who they think should lead these countries. It doesn't matter where you look but if the west has been there its a mess.

 

Lets not just confine this to a European problem, lets have a bit of responsible from our cousins across the pond too!   

 

People would have still complained had we left Gadaffi in power. 

 

There's no winning with people who believe that western imperialism is wrong. It's the only long term solution for many states. Go in (ground troops and all), let them have democracy over tax and spend but we force western law on them and hopefully over 30 years or so we can indoctrinate the children in the way we've done here about racism and gay rights ect.. then eventually we can free them.

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I think few could argue that we were instrumental in creating the current problem, but that is now pretty much by the by. We are where we are and the task is to find a solution to it, rather than arguing who created it in the first place - a lesson all the main parties in the up coming election could do from heeding too!

 

Without doubt the overall situation is extremely complex and the problems mindbogglingly numerous, but the reality is the potential solutions to the problem amount to a big fat 1. 

 

The option to allow untold amounts of African and Middle Eastern migrants to move and settle in Europe is a definite non starter. The numbers wanting to come IF restrictions were to be relaxed would be staggering and completely unmanageable, so after what will probably be weeks and weeks of right noises from Brussels, this will eventually be admitted/accepted.

 

So we are left with only one real option imo and that is to significantly step up patrols, stop as many coming either via sea, land or air and immediately repatriated those that do arrive - unless of course they can pass what will need to become significantly tougher asylum regulations.

 

Do I think this is right/acceptable? No I do not, frankly I'm appalled and embarrassed by that fact successive UK governments have stomped all over the region in the name of so called democracy, when in fact we all know it's been about one thing and one thing only - oil.

 

However, whether I or anyone else here think it's right/acceptable, I really can't see any other genuine option than to effectively pull up the drawbridge and leave these poor buggers to suffer from what we created.

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If action is not taken now (intercept and turn back these boats from whence they came at every opportunity) then Europe as a whole is leaving itself wide open to massive problems in the years to come..if Europe does not close it southern borders then I dont want to be around to see the consequences.

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If action is not taken now (intercept and turn back these boats from whence they came at every opportunity) then Europe as a whole is leaving itself wide open to massive problems in the years to come..if Europe does not close it southern borders then I dont want to be around to see the consequences.

In North America they would not stand for this, they'd have armed nautical patrols. Europe needs to start protecting its own identity, forget about doing "what's Christian". We've been too open for far too long, the fact folk can give some opportunists loads of money, and then hop aboard like penned animals and sail for Southern Italy. Is a crime and honestly they all ought to be all sent back, I do pity them but it's not our problem. We're simply drowning in others anguish, most of these refugees/migrants have London as their destination. Stop the problem at the source! There should be a quota distributing them out at the very least.

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There should be a quota distributing them out at the very least.

I know it sounds harsh..but Europe should not be distributing them anywhere...simply return them back from whence they came.

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I know it sounds harsh..but Europe should not be distributing them anywhere...simply return them back from whence they came.

 

Yeah, why not?  Or just put them out of there misery straight away?  I know it sounds a bit harsh but really, these people don't derserve any better.  Scum.

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