Manmade Climate Change Discussion

[Polar Maritime]

Yes Dev.. some people are all they condemn to be, very irresponsible... It's no wonder folk are confused.

[knocker]

Fortunately it says more about them than others.

[knocker]

http://forum.netweather.tv/topic/76448-scepticism-of-man-made-climate-change/page-49#entry2898751

 

As I have already posted the full statement from Copernicus Publications I will limit this post to correcting the blatant lie. They didn't close down the journal they decided on 17 January 2014 to cease the publication of PRP for the reasons given in their statement.

 

You will note, actually you probably won't, that with their official statement they included a link to all the published papers for those scientists who are interested,

 

http://www.pattern-recognition-in-physics.net/

Edited January 18, 2014 by knocker

[Devonian]

http://forum.netweather.tv/topic/76448-scepticism-of-man-made-climate-change/page-49#entry2898751As I have already posted the full statement from Copernicus Publications I will limit this post to correcting the blatant lie. They didn't close down the journal they decided on 17 January 2014 to cease the publication of PRP for the reasons given in their statement.You will note, actually you probably won't, that with their official statement they included a link to all the published papers for those scientists who are interested,http://www.pattern-recognition-in-physics.net/

Amazing, isn't it. They managed to get a number of cranks running the journal. They then, and its really daft to think no one would notice this*, get editorial board members 1,2,3 to write something board members 4,5,6 then 'peer' review and vice versa in different combinations. Laughable!* perhaps you hope they do so you can whine? Nope, I'm not a big supporter of conspiracy theories. Edited January 18, 2014 by Devonian

[Polar Maritime]

 

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/jan/16/another-year-of-global-cooling

 

Rather America-centric admittedly.
But at the same time because part of Australia has been hot that's supposed to be evidence of global warming

 

What a load of gibberish crap..

 

"If the current cooling trend continues for a few more years, the theory of global warming faces imminent extinction. It will then join a long list of other expired environmental doom-and-gloom predictions, including overpopulation, peak oil and nuclear winter."

 

Edited January 18, 2014 by Polar Maritime

[Gray-Wolf]

And , at the same time on the same continent this is occurring;

 

http://www.usatoday.com/story/weather/2014/01/17/california-drought-emergency/4581761/

 

With some areas having less than 60 days water left I bet they are praying for Nino to set up ( bust to boon?)

[knocker]

 

 

 

What a load of gibberish crap..

 

"If the current cooling trend continues for a few more years, the theory of global warming faces imminent extinction. It will then join a long list of other expired environmental doom-and-gloom predictions, including overpopulation, peak oil and nuclear winter."

 

 

 

Quite agree and not surprising as it's written by Dismal David Deming.

 

http://www.desmogblog.com/david-deming

 

And he doesn't confine his crap to climate matters either. He's a nasty piece of work. Can you believe this.

 

Sexual harassment charges

 

In February 2000, Deming wrote a letter criticizing Yale University student Joni Kletter's February 18, 2000, syndicated article on gun control published in the University of Oklahoma's student newspaper, The Oklahoma Daily—a letter for which the professor was charged for sexual harassment. In her article, Kletter had claimed that "easy access to a handgun allows everyone in this country . . . to quickly and easily kill as many random people as they want." In his rebuttal, Deming wrote

 

"I just want to point out that Kletter's 'easy access' to a vagina enables her to 'quickly and easily' have sex with 'as many random people' as she wants. Her possession of an unregistered vagina also equips her to work as a prostitute and spread venereal diseases. Let's hope Kletter is as responsible with her equipment as most gun owners are with theirs."

 

And for some more rubbish, guess where? You got it.

 

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/01/18/david-deming-another-year-of-global-cooling/

Edited January 18, 2014 by knocker

[Gray-Wolf]

So do we now have a consensus of what's weather is also climate now, because if we don't then why the hell are some on t'other thread linking the Aussie heat with climate when it was only t'other week when the same people were calling Americas record cold spell just weather. So can we have clarification on this, is it a case of climate is anything warm and wet whilst weather is anything cold. 

 

Seems SI can't tell the difference between a 3 day cold snap and an 18 month  extreme climate event( that includes warmest ever recorded winter and record warmest year that included the record highest temp ever recorded on the continent) that shows no sign of stopping ( early warnings already out for the sheep farmers to expect nino conditions in the NW of the country later in the year)?

 

In the U.S. Four linked us to an Article that has Misleaders linking a cold December to 'proof' that global cooling is here and yet in Ozz their misleaders are saying 18 months of 'weather' do not give any indication as to AGW???

 

SI says it's this thread that does such yet there are his folk making monkeys of themselves in the global media ( and not just these threads)...... such fun eh?

[knocker]

http://forum.netweather.tv/topic/76448-scepticism-of-man-made-climate-change/page-50#entry2899846

 

No point in letting the facts get in the way on fantasy island.

 

A heatwave affecting Argentina has left at least seven people dead - most of them elderly - in the past week, officials say.

 

The heat has been compounded by power cuts, which have prevented many people from using air conditioning.

 

In Santiago del Estero and other northern provinces temperatures have soared to over 45C (113F).

 

Meteorologists say it has been the worst heatwave in the region since records began in 1906.

 

The victims of the extreme weather lived in Santiago del Estero, located 1,100km (680 miles) north of Buenos Aires.

Hundreds of people in the province have required medical help and doctors have warned people to stay indoors during the hottest hours.

 

Posted correctly in the weather around the world thread.

 

http://forum.netweather.tv/topic/78948-heatwave-kills-seven-in-argentina/

 

GW was of course correct regarding the cold period in the US.

 

Last week’s Arctic outbreak brought some of the coldest air in decades across the Midwest and South. But interestingly, it didn’t last long.

The graphics below show the number of consecutive days during this month’s cold snap that temperatures stayed below freezing (midnight to midnight) in New York, Atlanta, and Chicago. In each case, the temperatures moderated far more quickly than was the case during some of the most intense cold waves of the last 40 years.

 

 

 

 

http://www2.ucar.edu/atmosnews/opinion/10928/cold-but-brief

Edited January 19, 2014 by knocker

[BornFromTheVoid]

An interesting piece by Michael Mann on why climate scientists should no longer sit by the sidelines, should engage the public and comment on the implications of their work.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/19/opinion/sunday/if-you-see-something-say-something.html?_r=0

 

Awaits the usual ad hominem and conspiracy theory attacks in response

[knocker]

http://forum.netweather.tv/topic/76448-scepticism-of-man-made-climate-change/page-50#entry2900102

 

A word of warning. To put it mildly Goddard is not the most reliable of sources. I think the Ark was still afloat the last time he was right. Just it's wise to verify from elsewhere.

Edited January 19, 2014 by knocker

[Midlands Ice Age]

http://forum.netweather.tv/topic/76448-scepticism-of-man-made-climate-change/page-50#entry2900102

 

A word of warning. To put it mildly Goddard is not the most reliable of sources. I think the Ark was still afloat the last time he was right. Just it's wise to verify from elsewhere.

 

Knocker,

 

I appreciate that, but the data and graphs do look to be genuine......

Time will tell whether he is right or wrong this time

 

MIA

[BornFromTheVoid]

Knocker,

 

I appreciate that, but the data and graphs do look to be genuine......

Time will tell whether he is right or wrong this time

 

MIA

 

He's been claiming the same thing for years now (I presume it's a he, Steven Goddard is a pseudonym though). You'll notice that many of the graphs he posted comes from the organisations he claims are covering things up. How can they be posting data on the adjustments they made for everyone to see and be covering things up at the same time?

 

There are many legitimate reasons why data needs to be adjusted. Such as changes to station locations, equipment, time that observations are made, etc. All the adjustments are there for a reason, and there are lots of studies on why they are necessary.

 

Even the satellite based temperature data at UAH, run by two of the few qualified climate sceptics, has undergone multiple revisions, most of which has increased the observed warming rate.

 

Sometimes these things are necessary and justified, no conspiracies needed.

[knocker]

He has indeed and the last time only a few months ago.

 

 

Science blogger Steven Goddard at Real Science has posted temperature comparison charts (available here, and here) showing just how dramatically the NOAA and NASA bureaucrats have doctored the U.S. temperature data during the past several decades. As the before-and-after temperature charts show, government bureaucrats with power and funding at stake have turned a striking long-term temperature decline (as revealed by the real-world data), into a striking long-term temperature increase.

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamestaylor/2012/06/13/doctored-data-not-u-s-temperatures-set-a-record-this-year/

[Gray-Wolf]

I think we're due a number of such 'sensationalist claims BFTV and you'll note the absence of an upcoming conference or some such? I think the odds of El Nino forming in late spring early summer are now growing and the absence of Nina's over the past 18 months might suggest that we will see a proper one ( and not the 'stunted affair we saw in 2010?) ? Should we see an 18 month event then you can bet that 98's global temp record will be sailed past ( 2010's stunted Nino gave it a run for it's money so a full blown Nino would have no problem besting it?).

 

We also see new info on Pacific cycles hinting to us that they may well be ready to 'flip' into their 'warm surface ocean' phase also promising a 'plumping up' of atmospheric temps across the globe?

 

We all know that we have a warming that has been generated by our actions ( and this has stopped a 'fall back' of temps over the 'cool driver' dominated period) so any return to 'natural warming' will also have this 'human element dumped on top of it.

 

How will the misleaders explain such temp hikes if not by trying to discredit the data itself?

 

I have always maintained that the money behind the misleaders also have access to the best climate models/science and so will  know that we have a new warming surge upon us , with the Nino the 'switch' , and so have to try another tack to confuse and mislead the general public (other than the old 'there has been no warming since 98').

[UV-RAY]

I do think its best until we get confirmation from an independent source before passing comment, as knocker says there has been instances where Goddard has, shall we say been wrong.

[Devonian]

"Posted Today, 13:34

 
New climate data rigging  in USA http://t.co/UsmvnHycm1"
 
 
Excellent, absolutely excellent! 
 
Mr 'Goddard' "spent the evening comparing graphs…and hit the NOAA motherlode". He spent the whole evening discovering this 'motherlode' 'error' that a whole host of other sceptic bloggers and mudslingers have missed!? A whole EVENING!!! Astonishing. What could he do if he spent a day at a problem - invent perpetual motion?
 
He then goes on to compare US temperatures to global ones as if the are the same - brilliant, brilliant absolutely world class blog science.
 
And it was all published by that surreal dream world of claptrap and crankism 'Principa Scientific' who's other achievements were proving the Moon is made of cheese and discovering the hole through which aliens enter the Earth at the North Pole (well, maybe not, but hey same ball park and you get my gist ).
 
'Goddard'  isn't just a genius he's a bloody scientific superstar.... sorry, got carried away, I mean  

Edited January 19, 2014 by Devonian

[Gray-Wolf]

Awww, C'mon Dev! give them back the rope! they 've already been tying the right knots (and right before our eyes)....... could you not have left them alone a little longer?(LOL)

 

I do have to wonder at the timing of this though? We have the Antarctic sea ice muddle just exposed ( and now being worked on by various teams?) and the prospect of a summer El Nino? There after we are told to expect a Pacific ocean flip to 'warm surface' phase (adding more heat into the atmosphere)?

 

I do think that the 'Drivers' of the Misleader movement know that the Hiatus was just about spent but that they did not expect the problems with the Antarctic Sea ice algorithms?

 

If you were them what would you do when your teams tell you that there really is an issue with the measure of Sea ice down South ( that will be amended by summer 2014) and so your second favourite 'Squirrel' was about to be taken from you just when Squirrel number 1 was set to evaporate ( along with large portions of the surface of the tropical Pacific...lol) around the same time?

 

It's almost as though the misleaders troops on the ground forgot that the current reduction in the rate of atmospheric warming really was a product of some hefty negative forcings and that they could use the 'slowdown' as a proof for ever? Now that they are getting the first whiff of it ending you can almost sense that things are about to turn nasty? I'm sure that the paymasters have not ordered such but the 'troops' they enlisted along the way will not be best pleased to see not only science proved right but them also entering into another 'warming surge'? 

 

If at the same time they lose the Antarctic Sea ice as a cudgel , leaving just the accelerating mass loss there, then what do they have to work with?

 

You can bet their paymasters have not been idle through the past decade and a half and , being in business, will know when to quit. I'm sure the past 15yrs or so have been an opportunity that they have not wasted ( we'll see no oil barons on skid row) but will they be there for their loyal troops? I think not!

 

The hidden paymaster will become world Green leaders with their drives into alternative energy production and their willingness to be seen to be fighting for a safer future by their mitigation efforts!

Edited January 19, 2014 by Gray-Wolf

[Devonian]

Awww, C'mon Dev!

 

...

 

Actually, I'm hoping for an encore  . DK has, I fear, a long life yet...

[UV-RAY]

Awww, C'mon Dev! give them back the rope! they 've already been tying the right knots (and right before our eyes)....... could you not have left them alone a little longer?(LOL)

 

I do have to wonder at the timing of this though? We have the Antarctic sea ice muddle just exposed ( and now being worked on by various teams?) and the prospect of a summer El Nino? There after we are told to expect a Pacific ocean flip to 'warm surface' phase (adding more heat into the atmosphere)?

 

I do think that the 'Drivers' of the Misleader movement know that the Hiatus was just about spent but that they did not expect the problems with the Antarctic Sea ice algorithms?

 

If you were them what would you do when your teams tell you that there really is an issue with the measure of Sea ice down South ( that will be amended by summer 2014) and so your second favourite 'Squirrel' was about to be taken from you just when Squirrel number 1 was set to evaporate ( along with large portions of the surface of the tropical Pacific...lol) around the same time?

 

It's almost as though the misleaders troops on the ground forgot that the current reduction in the rate of atmospheric warming really was a product of some hefty negative forcings and that they could use the 'slowdown' as a proof for ever? Now that they are getting the first whiff of it ending you can almost sense that things are about to turn nasty? I'm sure that the paymasters have not ordered such but the 'troops' they enlisted along the way will not be best pleased to see not only science proved right but them also entering into another 'warming surge'? 

 

If at the same time they lose the Antarctic Sea ice as a cudgel , leaving just the accelerating mass loss there, then what do they have to work with?

 

You can bet their paymasters have not been idle through the past decade and a half and , being in business, will know when to quit. I'm sure the past 15yrs or so have been an opportunity that they have not wasted ( we'll see no oil barons on skid row) but will they be there for their loyal troops? I think not!

 

The hidden paymaster will become world Green leaders with their drives into alternative energy production and their willingness to be seen to be fighting for a safer future by their mitigation efforts!

Would that be the same summer El Nino you predicted for last summer.

 

The rest of your post is up to your usual standard, mud slinging by calling all sceptics misleaders. You should be banned for such inflammatory remarks as it does nothing but stoke up the fires.

Edited January 19, 2014 by Sceptical Inquirer

[Devonian]

Would that be the same summer El Nino you predicted for last summer.

 

The rest of your post is up to your usual standard, mud slinging by calling all sceptics misleaders. You should be banned for such inflammatory remarks as it does nothing but stoke up the fires.

 

SI, can you please post such stuff to your thread. There you might post any opinions you have about Dr of blog science Mr 'Goddard's' revelations (because it's almost as if you ritual attacks on GW are a distraction from the embarrassment 'Goddard' is). 

Edited January 19, 2014 by Devonian

[UV-RAY]

SI, can you please post such stuff to your thread. There you might post any opinions you have about Dr of blog science Mr 'Goddard's' revelations (because it's almost as if you ritual attacks on GW are a distraction from the embarrassment 'Goddard' is). 

I think you'll find I'm not Godarrds biggest fan hence my post further up, and as for attacks well being called a misleader is ok then is it?

Edited January 19, 2014 by Sceptical Inquirer

[Devonian]

I think you'll find I'm not Godarrds biggest fan hence my post further up, and as for attacks well being called a misleader is ok then is it?

 

SI, YOU we not called a misleader anymore than four was calling me an astro turfer  , or foam flecked or indeed YOU were calling me a lunatic . Each and every of those description were non specific.

Edited January 19, 2014 by Devonian

[UV-RAY]

SI, YOU we not called a misleader anymore than four was calling me an astro turfer  , or foam flecked or indeed YOU called me a lunatic .

Yes but my post has a Lol smiley and wasn't meant whereas GW is deadly serious as you know and so must condone.

[knocker]

Some comments on Judith Curry's EPW testimony http://wp.me/p48oug-QY