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Scottish Politics 2011-2017


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Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    36 minutes ago, Ravelin said:

    ^^^ I await the Unionists frothing at the mouth over this appointment @scottish skier

     

    Aye. Here he is, our heid yin EU brexit negotiator. The top dog. The decision maker. The man we should all listen to.

    A really excellent choice for the job.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    And that ignorant, offensive, rant sums up exactly why the YES campaign failed  

    Good god. What a load of boarish spiteful bile from bad losers has been posted during the night. I actually dread to think how Scotland would be run if this is representative of how the yes vote behav

    I'm disappointed in the lack of grace shown by some across the net in accepting this No vote. A complete lack of any empathy and understanding as to why fellow Scots didn't vote Yes.   I personally

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    Posted
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL

    Brit Nats will not like the latest YouGov poll on Scottish ethnicity which shows that they are more likely to be Xenophobic Nazis than Scots Nats.

    Who would have thought.

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    Posted
  • Location: St rads Dover
  • Weather Preferences: Snow, T Storms.
  • Location: St rads Dover
    5 minutes ago, mountain shadow said:

    Brit Nats will not like the latest YouGov poll on Scottish ethnicity which shows that they are more likely to be Xenophobic Nazis than Scots Nats.

    Who would have thought.

    Until recently I wouldn't have thought about it at all. 

    Just yesterday, I took a bus home from Canterbury, a group of students from Italy got on and for some reason I felt ashamed. I hadn't done anything to them my self, but I couldn't shake that feeling. 

    Thing is I know many who voted leave didn't do so for xenophobic reasons, and I don't think that was the reason anyway. It was literally because we voted out I think. I'm an inner so I don't understand really why I feel ashamed about something I didn't want to happen. 

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    1 hour ago, mountain shadow said:

    Brit Nats will not like the latest YouGov poll on Scottish ethnicity which shows that they are more likely to be Xenophobic Nazis than Scots Nats.

    Who would have thought.

    Doesn't surprise me at all; british nationalism has always leaned more to the blood and soil type, hence all the right-wing groups backed the UK.

    However, while the conclusion is correct, I'd not read too much into the poll as it didn't specifically actually ask e.g. what might qualify people for Scottish citizenship.

    For example, my wife has been here for 16 years but does that make her Scottish?* I'd say no; I can't decide that for her, so it doesn't make her Scottish. And the Scottish government shouldn't be forcing a nationality on her certainly. However, I'd be happy for her to feel Scottish# / become a Scottish citizen if she wants.

    So, the poll did show that unionists are much more blood and soil leaning in terms of nationality, but don't much read too into actual numbers as the question was open ended in terms of what was asked and is being over interpreted.

    ---

    *which was how the question was approached

    #Which, incidentally, she feels. Cried her eyes out at the referendum result in 2014.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL
    17 minutes ago, scottish skier said:

     

    So, the poll did show that unionists are much more blood and soil leaning in terms of nationality, but don't much read into actual numbers as the question was open ended and is being over interpreted.

    ---

    *which was how the question was approached

    O I agree, however, I have spent the last few days on No sites being called a xenophobic nazi so its good to be able to go back with some facts to the uninformed Brit Nat.

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    Posted
  • Location: NR LOURDES SW FRANCE
  • Location: NR LOURDES SW FRANCE

    I don't see why Scotland can't stay in the EU or have a different relationship with it than the rest of the UK. And there doesn't have to be a hard border between Scotland and the rUK, if the government is so happy to have a common travel area between Ireland and Northern Ireland then why not Scotland and the rUK.

    Its perfectly feasible to have some flexibility across the UK, IMO its just blinkered thinking by the government.

    For example on EU migrants its not rocket science to just set up a system that allows Scotland to determine its own immigration policy and have NI numbers with a special status for those who are unable to work south of the border.

    There just seems to be a complete lack of imagination by the government and an unwillingness to entertain anything different. And surely if those in Westminster really care about keeping the UK intact then they should find a way to alleviate Scottish concerns. The attitude at the moment is of over confidence that Scottish voters will keep putting up with this crap and won't finally say enough is enough.

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    Posted
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)
  • Weather Preferences: Wind driven falling snow
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)
    45 minutes ago, scottish skier said:

    Doesn't surprise me at all; british nationalism has always leaned more to the blood and soil type, hence all the right-wing groups backed the UK.

    However, while the conclusion is correct, I'd not read too much into the poll as it didn't specifically actually ask e.g. what might qualify people for Scottish citizenship.

    For example, my wife has been here for 16 years but does that make her Scottish?* I'd say no; I can't decide that for her, so it doesn't make her Scottish. And the Scottish government shouldn't be forcing a nationality on her certainly. However, I'd be happy for her to feel Scottish# / become a Scottish citizen if she wants.

    So, the poll did show that unionists are much more blood and soil leaning in terms of nationality, but don't much read too into actual numbers as the question was open ended in terms of what was asked and is being over interpreted.

    ---

    *which was how the question was approached

    #Which, incidentally, she feels. Cried her eyes out at the referendum result in 2014.

    If your wife went back to France would she still be 100% French having been away for so long? Culture and nations move on a lot in 16 years. If someone born in Scotland had lived in France for the last 16 years would that person still be more Scottish than your wife? I don't think so, but I suppose it is down to individuals to decide.

    If folk want to be Scottish then why not let them? If not then fair enough, I could understand why someone might want to stay Italian (for example...is envy of other nations  proper thing??). 

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    Just now, CatchMyDrift said:

    If your wife went back to France would she still be 100% French having been away for so long? Culture and nations move on a lot in 16 years. If someone born in Scotland had lived in France for the last 16 years would that person still be more Scottish than your wife? I don't think so, but I suppose it is down to individuals to decide.

    If folk want to be Scottish then why not let them? If not then fair enough, I could understand why someone might want to stay Italian (for example...is envy of other nations  proper thing??). 

    Well no, she's self identifying French and Scottish now. Like you say, it's down to the individual how they feel.

    But even then national identity isn't a choice, so it's not even really up to the individual. It just happens to us by circumstance / experience. We start to feel an attachment to a country / culture...that it has become part of our own identity.

    We can to an extent choose formal documentary citizenship / nationality, or at least we can make a choice to change that / seek an alternative. However, our identity derives very much from the subconscious. 

    I guess it's like love; we can't choose to love someone; we either do or we don't. 

    I'm Scottish because I was born here and have lived most of my life here. That and my parents are Scottish too. But I didn't choose to be Scottish for these reasons, although they are the reason I ended up identifying that way. 

    In fact it was unionists who started me even questioning what my identity was, beginning in early 90's. I did have a British identity of sorts I recall, but they chipped away at it bit by bit, leaving me with nothing left there really, at least politically.

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    Posted
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
    15 hours ago, scottish skier said:

     

    Incidentally, another nice 0.4 billion Scotland needs to cough up there to repair the English parliament, adding to our, ahem, 'deficit'.

    And you can bet it will be way more than 4 billion to repair. It's not as if the UK finishes projects on time and to budget.

    Yes I remember this seemingly never ending spiralling fiasco at the time..:)

    From the Scotsman Newspaper

    SCOTLAND’S controversial parliament building at Holyrood has achieved probably its most embarrassing accolade to date: it is now officially ranked as one of the worst building projects in the world for cost overruns.

    The latest 400 million cost forecast for the project represents a 900 per cent increase on the original estimate of 40million.

    Fergus Ewing, the SNP MSP and consistent critic of the Holyrood project, said: "The Scottish Parliament may not be a medal winner in the cost overrun stakes, but the majority of Scottish people are still perplexed as to how the estimated cost has risen so dramatically."

    In arguably the most spectacular mismanagement of public finances ever, the original estimate for the construction of the Scottish Parliament building, Holyrood, did not even cover the final tax bill.

    Over nearly 10 years projected costs of £40m ballooned to a final bill of over £400m as design changes, overruns and a hugely ambitious architectural specification turned what should have been the pride of Scotland's burgeoning political ambition into a major embarrassment.

    In attempting to design a building that reflected both the geography and culture of Scotland, the joint Spanish/Scottish architectural team EMBT-RMJM created mountains of extra costs.

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    Posted
  • Location: Highland Scotland
  • Location: Highland Scotland

    It's quite amazing how some parts of the MSM still try and portray the Scottish Parliament construction project as proof of Scottish Government incompetence. Obviously the Scottish Government didn't exist and there were no MSPs when the Scottish Parliament project contracts were let and the project initialised, that was done by the UK Government.

    Holyrood was chosen in part because Labour saw the Calton Hill site as a "nationalist shibboleth", Dewar reportedly saw the proximity to the Palace of Holyrood House as symbolic of the Union. The £40m figure was never taken seriously, it was an uncosted guess for an unspecified project, but major terrorism incidents that happened during the project's construction phase lead to massive reappraisal of the security standards required of the new parliament and that was one of the biggest cost driving factors. The untimely death of the architect Enric Miralles created significant problems for the project as well. 

    I'll just note here that the two most outrageous public sector project cost overruns in Scotland in modern times were both delivered by Labour led bodies, the other being the Edinburgh Trams where half a line ended up costing twice what was budgeted for an network! 

    Edited by skifreak
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    8 hours ago, kar999 said:

    Yes I remember this seemingly never ending spiralling fiasco at the time..:)

    From the Scotsman Newspaper

    SCOTLAND’S controversial parliament building at Holyrood has achieved probably its most embarrassing accolade to date: it is now officially ranked as one of the worst building projects in the world for cost overruns.

    As I said, that's the UK for you.

    Although it highlights very well how if 400 million for a brand new parliament is a massive wasteful overspend, then 4 billion - as just the initial estimate - is, well....

    They should flog Westminster to the private sector and build a new, modern parliament; an English one like the devolved nations have.

    Then we can have a small 'one nation one vote' senate for the UK that rotates its location.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
    50 minutes ago, scottish skier said:

    As I said, that's the UK for you.

    Although it highlights very well how if 400 million for a brand new parliament is a massive wasteful overspend, then 4 billion - as just the initial estimate - is, well....

    They should flog Westminster to the private sector and build a new, modern parliament; an English one like the devolved nations have.

    Then we can have a small 'one nation one vote' senate for the UK that rotates its location.

    That's the price we pay for Unions eh! Not quite as bad as Brussels and a clone in Stassbourg though. :bomb:

    I still voted remain though. :)

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    22 minutes ago, kar999 said:

    That's the price we pay for Unions eh! Not quite as bad as Brussels and a clone in Stassbourg though. :bomb:

    I still voted remain though. :)

    The EU union is definitely the cheaper one.

    It doesn't want to collect the vast bulk of your taxes then only give you back what it decides for example.

    Much more democratic too; the Senate (Council) is one nation one vote.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: NH7256
  • Weather Preferences: where's my vote?
  • Location: NH7256

    The thing with various parliamentry buildings.... they're all so different. Westminster is a historic building of immense English national significance, so the cost of renovation is regarded (in England) as justifiable.  Holyrood is modern and in its short history has been used as a football, but personally I think it's a much better building than Westminster - more suited to sensible debate than the Westminster shouting-house. Strasbourg I found to be soul-less but that might have been influenced by the bleakness of the city.  Nor did I take to either the French or German versions.  Holyrood looks good value to me. (Apologies for the non-sequitors :drunk-emoji: )

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    Posted
  • Location: The Garden of England
  • Weather Preferences: A large kack of heavy cloud
  • Location: The Garden of England

    For £4bn I'd want a parliament building like the one in Star Wars which towers up seemingly to infinity and members float down to the speaking platform in a special pod when its their turn to speak.

    Corbyn's pod could be pedal powered.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Good stuff.

    Quote

    http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/snp-pledge-block-dwps-hated-8801234

    SNP pledge to block DWP's hated benefits sanctions regime from operating in Scotland

    EQUALITIES Secretary Angela Constance is not going to 'assist' the UK department responsible for sanctions when Holyrood takes new welfare powers.

    ...in an interview with the Record, Constance said: “While we can’t stop the UK Government putting conditions on the work-related benefits, we’re not going to be giving them any information or responding to inquiries if we think that might lead to a sanction...

     

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Chortle.

    EU is definitely trolling England.

    Quote

    It's perfectly possible that the EU say Scottish indy - if that's what the European Citizens of the country of Scotland wish - is a condition of any brexit deal. 

    After all, it is the duty of the EU to act on behalf of EU citizens, which includes the people of Scotland who voted to Remain that in June.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    6 minutes ago, Dougal said:

    For £4bn I'd want a parliament building like the one in Star Wars which towers up seemingly to infinity and members float down to the speaking platform in a special pod when its their turn to speak.

    Corbyn's pod could be pedal powered.

    4 Billion would definitely buy you something like that.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Beverley, East Yorks. (2 metres a.s.l.)
  • Weather Preferences: Something good in all four seasons
  • Location: Near Beverley, East Yorks. (2 metres a.s.l.)

    A programme tonight on BBC2 at 8pm might be of interest ..

    'Scotland And The Battle For Britain' ..  Part one of two.

    'Andrew Marr discovers why Scotland has changed so much politically and whether after

    the Brexit vote we will see the break up of the UK.'

    I'll be watching.  Guess it's on in Scotland at the same time.

    B. :)

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    Posted
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL

    Thanks for the heads up.

    I don't think it's Scotland that's changed though but England.  The New Labour Blair /Brown project pulled English politics way to far right and Scotland refused to go with it.

    As Mairi Black said in her maiden speach,  it was Labour left her, not the other way around. 

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Aye. June was another example; Scotland and England both voted to join the EC in 1975.

    Not Scotland that's changed. 

    As for the programme; anything by the BBC, and particularly starring Marr, is unlikely to be insightful.

    The best programme I know remains STVs Road to Referendum, although even it skips key elements.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Really fills you with faith in Team GB for the brexit negotiations. Bozo, Fox, Davis; it truly is Carry on up the European Community.

    Glad Guy Verhofstadt is negotiating on behalf of Scotland.

    Quote

    https://archive.is/SzmYx

    May told to 'get a grip' of Brexiteers after latest gaffe

    LIAM Fox has "fundamentally undermined" his ability to represent Britain when it comes to trade after he accused UK companies of being "too lazy and too fat".

    SNP International Trade spokesperson Tasmina Ahmed-Sheikh added that the prominent Brexiteer must also apologise.

    Fox's comments provided a fresh Brexit-related gaffe for Prime Minister Theresa May to deal with after her International Trade Secretary launched the extraordinary attack on the businesses he is meant to promote.

    Fox told fellow right-wing Tories that British business was “too lazy and too fat”, with executives preferring “golf on a Friday afternoon” to fighting for exports.

    His comments, recorded at a drinks reception for the Thatcherite Conservative Way Forward group, provoked a wave of criticism. Downing Street distanced itself from what it called Fox’s “private views”.

    Earlier this week, the Prime Minister was also forced to correct Brexit Secretary David Davis after he said it was “very improbable” the UK could stay in the EU single market. Critics said the back-to-back blunders betrayed chaos inside government over Brexit.

    Fox, a former GP who is one of the ‘Three Brexiteers’, alongside Davis and Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson, said British business culture had to change.

     

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Kingdom of Fife: 56.2º N, 3.2º W
  • Location: Kingdom of Fife: 56.2º N, 3.2º W

    It is becoming increasingly clear that there is no place for Scotland within the British Union. There is no UK, only an arrogant English dominated Westminster determined to subsume any thoughts of equality between disparate nations that comprise Britain. It will truck no dissent.

    Independence or increasing dominance. This is the stark choice facing Scotland. There are no other options.

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