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Scottish Politics 2011-2017


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Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    7 minutes ago, Dougal said:

    I agree, I think this has run its course here for now. 

    I reckon its likely to become a political issue in the build up to any 2nd ref though as things have changed dramatically since 2014.

    I think both sides will need to be ready to define and defend their positions ahead of this.

    As I said before, I'm only here to learn more about the debate and perhaps test the Indy argument a bit. 

    Have a good day. :)

     

     

    Fair enough.

    Anyone with a different franchise proposal can put that forward to the Scottish government. I'm sure they will give it due consideration.

    It would need to be fully fleshed out though, detailing the exact criteria that defines who qualifies if they are not already on the electoral register. Vague terms like 'People who have an interest' and 'Scots living in England' will not stand up to public scrutiny, never mind in court if it came to it. Qualifying criteria need to be precisely defined, with what documentation would be required for registration etc.

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    And that ignorant, offensive, rant sums up exactly why the YES campaign failed  

    Good god. What a load of boarish spiteful bile from bad losers has been posted during the night. I actually dread to think how Scotland would be run if this is representative of how the yes vote behav

    I'm disappointed in the lack of grace shown by some across the net in accepting this No vote. A complete lack of any empathy and understanding as to why fellow Scots didn't vote Yes.   I personally

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    Posted
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie
  • Weather Preferences: Cold and snowy or warm and dry
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie

    At the risk of opening a real can of worms, this was the subject of this mornings phone in on Radio Scotland...

    Quote

    A council is contemplating moves which could make it harder for parents to get their children into one of Scotland's most prestigious state schools.

    St Ninian's Roman Catholic Secondary School in East Renfrewshire enjoys an enviable reputation.

    Many parents who live outside the catchment area and are not Catholics want their children to go there.

    The council said it wanted to help ensure Catholic children get a place in its Catholic schools.

    It said it might not have enough places in its RC schools to meet demand if current trends continued.

    A plan for a consultation on the admission arrangements for schools will be discussed by councillors on Thursday.

    One idea is to ask parents who want to send their children to one of its Roman Catholic schools to produce baptismal certificates - this would not be a condition of entry, simply a factor in prioritising places if there were not enough.


    My first thought was, "would we even be discussing this if it was race rather than religion?". For example, imagine we had "white" and "non-racial-discriminatory" schools rather than "catholic" and "non-denominational" schools. The outrage there would rightly be if a council decided to check birth certificates for racial heritage to be used as "simply a factor in prioritising places". Of course, that's forgetting the outrage there would rightly be if we had that system in place at all.

    I only hear the first few minutes of the debate but was amused by one woman who phoned in. She disputed that separate schools led to sectarianism on the basis that her 4, non-catholic, kids all went to catholic schools and were "well rounded and had many catholic friends, who they have since leaving school". Surely that in itself proves the point that if you integrate kids of different faiths they become friends and don't see each other as some sorts of strange other species. I still remember as a kid finding it weird that half the kids I played with in my street went to the school 2 mins from our doors and the rest of us walked across the village to a different school.

     

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    Posted
  • Location: Wylye , Wiltshire
  • Location: Wylye , Wiltshire

    Scottish culture well and truly thriving in London......

    Just been to brilliant performance of "Our ladies of perpetual succour " at NT in London. 

    Standing ovation at the end of what is one of the hottest tickets in town. Quite brilliant 

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    Posted
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie
  • Weather Preferences: Cold and snowy or warm and dry
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie
    5 minutes ago, scottish skier said:

    I'll just leave this here.

    #BrexitBritain

    If ever there was a time for someone to exercise thier Second Amendment rights.... 

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Jokes aside, Donald Trump is a very influential figure on the Westminster parties. It goes way back; from mugs with 'Immigration' on them, to the 'immigrants go home' vans.

    Theresa May needs to keep those Trump voters on side; it's them that are currently giving the Tories their lead and forcing her to stick to Brexit means Brexit.

    It is the nature of the FPTP system. Smaller parties like Trump's just need to threaten to take away that majority by stealing votes to shape Westminster. It's why the latter is becoming so reactionary. UKIP don't need to win seats, only votes.

    Trump gave us Brexit, even though he never set foot in the commons. As I said before, in Britain, Trump won.

    When brexit goes belly up, it will be the immigrants and the jocks who get the blame. After all, we jocks are now less popular than Clinton with the brexiteers.

    Britain is entering a dark place. It is not just the economic damage we should fear. The fact my wife remains under threat of deportation by Trump's brownshirts is case in point.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Stoke Gifford, Bristol
  • Location: Stoke Gifford, Bristol

    What's happened to the Scottish economy? 

    Reports of a deficit equiv to 9.5% pf Scottish GDP (UK as a whole 4%). Due to oil revenue collapse apparently.

    I'm surprised no one has commented.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    13 minutes ago, Bristle boy said:

    What's happened to the Scottish economy? 

    Being part of the UK, rather obviously. It's Westminster in charge of the economy and their figures.

    Being run by the UK is very economically damaging and eyewateringly expensive according to the Treasury and the ONS, should you wish to take GERS as being correct (I'd listen to the Cuthberts on that).

    ---

    What I found interesting was that oil revenues have all but vanished due to the downturn, yet no change in deficit due to a huge boost in onshore revenues with unemployment the same as the UK essentially. Oil is a bonus confirmed once more.

     

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: North York Moors
  • Location: North York Moors

    Scotland's economy and population are both smaller than Yorkshire.

    There I've said it.

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    Posted
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL
    11 minutes ago, Bristle boy said:

    What's happened to the Scottish economy? 

    Reports of a deficit equiv to 9.5% pf Scottish GDP (UK as a whole 4%). Due to oil revenue collapse apparently.

    I'm surprised no one has commented.

    Because most posters on here know that the GERS figures are nothing more than Westminster propoganda which was indeed why they were produced in the first place. 

    Why do we not see daily headlines in the UK union press about the UK'S blackhole of a national debt which is now well North of a trillion pounds? 

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    British logic:

    Being in the EU is damaging the UK economically, we need to Leave!

    Being in the UK is damaging Scotland economically, it needs to stay!

    And when Scotland also leaves, they'll still not understand why.

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    Posted
  • Location: Sedgley Black country 731ft 222 metres
  • Location: Sedgley Black country 731ft 222 metres
    5 minutes ago, scottish skier said:

    British logic:

    Being in the EU is damaging the UK economically, we need to Leave!

    Being in the UK is damaging Scotland economically, it needs to stay!

    And when Scotland also leaves, they'll still not understand why.

    do you think  British Logic  really is  being in the eu is damaging the uk economically   we need to leave?    i thought that was more  English logic.  Also  we can you get the information  for size of regional economies in the UK?

    Edited by weirpig
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    8 minutes ago, mountain shadow said:

    Because most posters on here know that the GERS figures are nothing more than Westminster propoganda which was indeed why they were produced in the first place. 

    Yes, but it mystifies me why they don't say 'Look, Scotland is prospering in the UK!'.

    I mean that's what you do if you want to keep the UK together. Playing with the figures to say 'Look, being in the UK is terrible for Scotland' has the opposite effect quite obviously.

    It's why the Brexiteers went on and on about how the UK was being economically damaged by the EU. How it had lost all its heavy industry with the EU etc. And it worked.

    Scotland is no different to any other country. If it thinks being run by the UK is damaging it economically, it will leave. So it really is bizarre to have UK unionists doing their best to try and prove that being in the UK is doing exactly that. 

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    7 minutes ago, weirpig said:

    do you think  British Logic  really is  being in the eu is damaging the uk economically   we need to leave?    i thought that was more  English logic.  Also  we can you get the information  for size of regional economies in the UK?

    It was the British in Scotland who supported brexit primarily, and the ones now saying we should leave with the rUK.

    People who identify as Scottish voted for the EU in large majority. The opposite to England, where English identifiers voted strongly to leave.

    Scotland is the third most prosperous area in the UK in terms of GDP per capita after London and SE.

    You can get regional data for England from the ONS, athough it's off topic for this thread.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Stoke Gifford, Bristol
  • Location: Stoke Gifford, Bristol

    So......does Scotland have a deficit equiv to 9.5% of its GDP?

    Lucky Scotland didnt plump for Inde the other year.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    4 minutes ago, Bristle boy said:

    So......does Scotland have a deficit equiv to 9.5% of its GDP?

    Lucky Scotland didnt plump for Inde the other year.

    No. For example, a big chunk of that is paying England's debts, for trident, for an extra parliament, for HS2, for London's new sewers, for loads of civil service jobs in London... But believe what you like.

    If you want to tell people the UK is hurting Scotland / is costing it a fortune, do so by all means.

    GERS says 'This is what the UK costs Scotland'.

    Every year we go through this, and every year Yes increases in the polls. 

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
    40 minutes ago, Bristle boy said:

    What's happened to the Scottish economy? 

    Reports of a deficit equiv to 9.5% pf Scottish GDP (UK as a whole 4%). Due to oil revenue collapse apparently.

    I'm surprised no one has commented.

     

    An independent Scotland would have a bigger budget deficit than any other country in the EU including Greece, according to figures published yesterday.

    In a development that raises question marks over the SNP’s push for independence, annual figures showed that the shortfall in the Scottish economy is being met by taxpayers from the rest of the UK. The figures setting out Scotland’s fiscal position for 2015-16 revealed that the size of its deficit, at £14.8 billion, was up £500 million from the year before.

    The statistics also reveal how devastating the collapse in the price of North Sea oil has been. It has dropped from $100 a barrel two years ago to less half that now.

    Four years ago, Scotland’s share of oil revenues topped £11 billion. Even in 2014-15, its share of North Sea tax receipts was £1.8 billion. The latest figures revealed that, by 2015-16, oil revenues had slumped to £60 million — a drop of 97 per cent in a year. Experts warned that this might be the pattern for years to come. Graeme Roy, director of Strathclyde University’s Fraser of Allander Institute, warned that the oil figures were likely to be the “new normal”, given the long-term outlook for the oil and gas sector.

    Scotland’s spending on public services has continued to rise and by the last financial year reached £12,800 per person, £1,200 more than is spent in the rest of the UK.

    http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/new-figures-reveal-scotlands-deficit-8695158

    It's all Westminster propaganda apparently.......(.I must stop reading the Daily Record. :bomb:)

    Either that or there's something wrong with the calculations with oil at sub $50 a barrel and 90% geographic share of North Sea revenues.

    Maybe they should have used $100 a barrel and 100% allocation. :hi:

     

    Edited by kar999
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    Posted
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie
  • Weather Preferences: Cold and snowy or warm and dry
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie
    1 hour ago, scottish skier said:

    What I found interesting was that oil revenues have all but vanished due to the downturn, yet no change in deficit due to a huge boost in onshore revenues with unemployment the same as the UK essentially. Oil is a bonus confirmed once more.

     

    What I found most interesting, and depressingly unsurprising, was that Reporting Scotland on the BBC heavily emphasised the drop in oil revenues but completely failed to mention the corresponding,  almost identical,  rise in non oil revenues. It really was quite a blatant piece of propaganda. 

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    Posted
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie
  • Weather Preferences: Cold and snowy or warm and dry
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie
    40 minutes ago, kar999 said:

    It's all Westminster propaganda apparently.......(.I must stop reading the Daily Record. :bomb:

     

    The Daily Record, the author of "the Vow",  isn't exactly known for its impartially. 

    Anyway, why hasn't anyone led on the 1.9bn increase in non oil revenues, after all that's greater than the 1.8bn decrease in oil revenues. So despite that oil revenue drop the deficit is actually smaller than last year. Why does no one scream "Scotland's deficit narrows despite massive drop in oil revenues"? 

    As has already been said, one of the major flaws with using the GERS figures to 'bash' independence is the assumption that an independent Scotland would continue to do everything identically after independence. That's just not going to happen, otherwise what'd be the point? 

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Well, this suggests England can't be an independent country if Scotland can't be. Only London maybe.

    Where the wealth is generated (excludes oil revenues), and where it is sucked to.

    This is why GERS suggests a deficit; it's caused by the flow of wealth generated in Scotland being taken to the SE of England.

    It's why the English government wish to maintain the UK and why the Treasury produces the very limited GERS figures it does, consistently refusing Scottish government requests for the data necessary to produce a more accurate picture.

    UKGVA.png

    Big-Wealth-Gap.jpg

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'

    Time, me thinks, for a rewrite of Scottish Government’s White Paper on independence November 2013 as no matter whatever political gloss you put on it the base data is now vastly changed.

     

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    7 minutes ago, kar999 said:

    Time, me thinks, for a rewrite of Scottish Government’s White Paper on independence November 2013 as no matter whatever political gloss you put on it the base data is now vastly changed.

     

    Totally. The EU thing is huge now obviously. Independence is a must to be sure of staying in. There is one mother of a freight train crash coming down the line here.

    Likewise, the UK writing off any chance of Scotland sharing curreny + debt repayments has enormous implications. Scotland would begin independence debt free.

    In addition, as Ravelin points out, the oil is just a bonus thing has been proven beyond doubt. Oil revenues have crashed to almost nothing, yet total revenues have grown to cancel it out. At the same time, in the worst oil downturn in nearly 2 decades, Scottish unemployment = 5%, UK = 5%.

    Edited by scottish skier
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