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Scottish Politics 2011-2017


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Posted
  • Location: Beccles, Suffolk.
  • Weather Preferences: Thunder, snow, heat, sunshine...
  • Location: Beccles, Suffolk.
    12 minutes ago, scottish skier said:

    Well, Dave and George finally jump in at the last minute and give in to Sturgeon and Swinney, agreeing a fair fiscal deal on devo nano minus. At least for the next parliament.

    Well, the powers may be well away from the Devo Max Scotland voted for in May, but Scotland just got more independent and that's good. Who knows, maybe we'll go the Australia / NZ way in time.

    Next up the BBC and a Scottish 6 o'clock news / bye bye London news. This is just in the planning stage, but I loved the fact it had the Daily Mail in frothing spasms today.

    _88398090_mail.jpg

    Aye, there's nothing more entertaining than an apoplectic Daily Mail!:rofl:

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    And that ignorant, offensive, rant sums up exactly why the YES campaign failed  

    Good god. What a load of boarish spiteful bile from bad losers has been posted during the night. I actually dread to think how Scotland would be run if this is representative of how the yes vote behav

    I'm disappointed in the lack of grace shown by some across the net in accepting this No vote. A complete lack of any empathy and understanding as to why fellow Scots didn't vote Yes.   I personally

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    Posted
  • Location: Wylye , Wiltshire
  • Location: Wylye , Wiltshire

    Nevertheless, great to hear, that despite all the doubts of many in this thread, the SG and UK govt have jointly  agreed an agreement which sees the VOW fully implemented. 

    A bit of good news for a change 

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    17 minutes ago, Arthur said:

    Nevertheless, great to hear, that despite all the doubts of many in this thread, the SG and UK govt have jointly  agreed an agreement which sees the VOW fully implemented. 

    A bit of good news for a change 

    Yes. Seems Cameron and Osborne intervened at the last minute to push the treasury into a deal by the deadline.

    It could have been done months ago if the Treasury had just honored the Smith Agreement 'no detriment' clause (which works both ways). That's basically all they were sticking on as they knew it could cost Scotland billions down the line and were hoping to force that on Scotland.

    The only way to avoid the no detriment clause would be full fiscal autonomy / devo max, as the Scottish people voted for in May but was rejected by England.

    Then you have all the tax and spending powers so stand on your own two feet fully. The Scotland bill is very limited with London still taking huge swaths of Scottish taxes, so there needed to be guarantees of a fair share of this. Likewise, without full tax and spend control, the Scottish government have very limited powers to grow the economy.

    Sadly, Holyrood remains one of the weakest 'regional parliaments' there is globally. Jersey has more powers! Better than nothing though.

    Essentially, little to nothing has changed; as usual, just some tinkering around the edges. I'll take it though.

    Anyway, as we were and independence supporters will keep on supporting independence...

     

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    Posted
  • Location: Beccles, Suffolk.
  • Weather Preferences: Thunder, snow, heat, sunshine...
  • Location: Beccles, Suffolk.

    And I find myself agreeing with Cameron & Gideon - who'd'a thunk it!:shok:

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Out of interest, with the ability of Holyrood to raise income taxes from 17/18 differently on different bands, are we back to Labour having no policies again?

    I mean you are not going to raise all bands when you can adjust variably, and in a progressive manner, in a year or two?

    ---

    In the meantime, the SNP should put devo max in their May manifesto. Get another mandate for that and then just start implementing it.

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    Posted
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL

    In the unlikely event that the SNP raised income tax would any extra income simply be reduced from the block grant or would Scotland retain the extra funds?

    I'm not sure.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    16 minutes ago, mountain shadow said:

    In the unlikely event that the SNP raised income tax would any extra income simply be reduced from the block grant or would Scotland retain the extra funds?

    I'm not sure.

    My understanding is that any raises would, finally, be kept by Scotland, as that's not considered a detriment to the UK. I fully expect the SNP, should we actually get to it, to play a little with the rates to make them more progressive.

    However, having only control of income tax is like driving a car and all you can do is steer a wee bit in one direction. No brakes, no accelerator, no gears; not even a clear windscreen. 

    Hence no detriment clause must apply; i.e. what Swinney and Sturgeon made sure of while the Tories sought a fiscal trap to strip billions from the Scottish budget, then backed down on as they saw they'd lost.

    It's all so silly as devo nano minus is crumbs from the table.

    Still, each thing that the Scottish government controls renders independence less of a change. Screams about income taxes upon independence carry little water if they've been set in Scotland for years already.

    It's known as Robertson's Law, i.e. 'Devolution will kill nationalism stone dead'.

     

     

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    This is interesting.

    Quote

    https://archive.is/Hp3EN#selection-717.1-717.363

    Mr Salmond added: “Could it happen practically? Well, the answer to that is yes as well. Why? Because...if the UK votes out [of the EU], there’s a two-year period under the Lisbon treaty. And what would happen then is Scotland would negotiate its position and, effectively, Scotland would just stay in and the rest of the UK would move out. So it’s a yes to both questions.”

    Salmond saying something I've said(?). Scotland could become independent in the EU as a result of a Brexit without even the need for a new Scottish iref. After all, it would be the rUK voting to Leave the EU and Scotland, while Scotland votes to stay where it is / status quo; a country in the EU.

    Likewise, each day the Scottish electorate are being made aware that Scotland will not be leaving the EU if it votes to stay / Scottish independence would most likely be the outcome of a Brexit.

    I suspect negotiations between the Scottish Government and EU will have already begun here in preparation for a potential Brexit.

     

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: glasgow
  • Weather Preferences: snowy winters hot summers
  • Location: glasgow
    27 minutes ago, scottish skier said:

     

    I suspect negotiations between the Scottish Government and EU will have already begun here in preparation for a potential Brexit.

     

    I would hope so. Its the sensible thing to do under the circumstances , though i still believe the uk will vote narrowly to stay in the EU and for things to rumble on .

    Pity we couldnt get the EU to come out and do a barroso type statement about Scotland remaining in the EU if england votes out.

    Poetic justice if they did .

    As they say , what goes around comes around....................

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Worth keeping in mind that, with Holyrood elections coming, the Scottish Tories just brazenly tried to unfairly shaft Scotland out of $7 billion.

    Peeps really want to give them MSPs?

    Ruth says the Scottish Tories are the true unionist party. Clearly that means hanging Scotland out to dry if they can.

    #fiscalframework

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Tories going ahead with their gerrymandering.

    Planned % reduction in number of MPs in the UK Parliament:

    England = 6%
    Scotland = 10%
    Wales = 26%

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-35652511

    #BetterTogether

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    Posted
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)
  • Weather Preferences: Wind driven falling snow
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)
    15 hours ago, scottish skier said:

    Tories going ahead with their gerrymandering.

    Planned % reduction in number of MPs in the UK Parliament:

    England = 6%
    Scotland = 10%
    Wales = 26%

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-35652511

    #BetterTogether

    Ah democracy. So the UK will soon have 50% more unelected lawmakers than elected lawmakers? How backward is that? If another country was actively moving towards unelected lawmakers we'd think they were backward too! Added to that is the increase in the ratio of population to MP, making the elected chamber far less representative of the people it supposedly serves. At least Holyrood has a far lower ratio of population per MSP making it far easier for any individual to get access. 

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    Posted
  • Location: Devizes Wiltshire
  • Location: Devizes Wiltshire

    Guido FawkesVerified account‏@GuidoFawkes

    Foreign Office confirms to @SkyNews Natalie McGarry WAS arrested by Turkish special forces http://order-order.com/2016/02/25/natalie-mcgarry-arrested-by-turkish-special-forces/

    Yep she use to be a SNP whip

     

    Dont know if this belongs in scots r middle east topic.. 

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    40 minutes ago, lfcdude said:

    Dont know if this belongs in scots r middle east topic.. 

    Thanks but:

     

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    'Vile nationalists' implying people who are for the EU are anti-British?

    #ironyoverload #EUref

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Really good article on the 'Scottish Six' concept. Well worth a read.

    Although IMO, it should just be called the 'Six o'clock' news. When you go to e.g. Norway, they don't make a point of saying the news is Norwegian; this goes without saying in a normal country.

    Anyway, usual suspects freaking out at the prospect. No idea why; most can still watch standard BBC London news at press of a button or click of mouse if that takes their fancy.

    Quote

    http://bellacaledonia.org.uk/2016/02/25/dont-cringe-in-my-backyard/

    Don’t Cringe in My Backyard

    Stuart Cosgrove destroys the cultural cringe* around a Scottish Six.

    Ok, in the week that Scotland has shocked international journalism by admitting it doesn’t have a national evening news service, I put forward an argument for greater ambition and proffer the following running order for the Scottish Six...

    *The Scottish cringe is of course not something that Scottish people have / feel. It's only British Scots (proud 'but') that feel it, and that says more about them / their attempts to keep up appearances when travelling south...

    ---

    I was listening to a discussion on BBC Radio Shortbread re the EU referendum and it made me think about this. Why not say it like it is? The BBC was trying to pretend it was all a UK thing, but a proper Scottish broadcaster would put everything in context, e.g.

    'England voted for parties backing a referendum on the EU, even though Scotland and the other three home nations did not. Scotland is being forced to vote on the matter, and could be taken out of the EU against it's will, even though the Scottish Parliament opposes withdrawal. We'd like to hear your views...

    That's not biased pro-SNP stuff, it's the simple truth / reality.

     

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    Posted
  • Location: Kingdom of Fife: 56.2º N, 3.2º W
  • Location: Kingdom of Fife: 56.2º N, 3.2º W

    Scottish Six produced by London for the promotion of London in Scotland. But we might let you have a Scot butt fronting it. That's before we make the pilots and then decide it will cost too much so we'll just scrap the Scottish bit and call it The Six O'clock News. OK, carry on!

    There is no way an independent Scottish News will be countenanced by Westminster. Total farce.

     

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    Posted
  • Location: Kingdom of Fife: 56.2º N, 3.2º W
  • Location: Kingdom of Fife: 56.2º N, 3.2º W

    Historic day for the iconic Flying Scotsman travelling from London up the East Coast to. . . York!

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    16 minutes ago, frogesque said:

    Scottish Six produced by London for the promotion of London in Scotland. But we might let you have a Scot butt fronting it. That's before we make the pilots and then decide it will cost too much so we'll just scrap the Scottish bit and call it The Six O'clock News. OK, carry on!

    There is no way an independent Scottish News will be countenanced by Westminster. Total farce.

     

    I agree. I'd be really surprised if any effort was made to actually do what's needed. Going by the plans to throw together some pilots in three weeks, I don't expect much. Looks like a standard, ill thought out, panicked reactionary response to counter 'the nats'. Always playing catch-up to what's happening in Scotland.

    However, that would be another foot shooting exercise. A well made, quality [Scottish] Six News as part of a devolved BBC Scotland would be something that strengthened the union. It would give an example of the supposed 'family of nations' stuff that's espoused.

    If they screw it up, intentionally or not, it just points out what the Yes camp has been saying all along; Britain is about London / England and they don't give a crap about Scotland.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    LOL. Just another example of why I'd never buy the [English] Telegraph. I'd like proper news, informative and relevant to the country I live in.

    Was at Aberdeen airport recently buying some water post-security and the woman behind the till was like 'you can get this water free if you buy the telegraph'. I said something like 'No, I don't want the Telegraph thanks' and she laughed and said 'Yes, everyone says that! just take the discount water and we bin the Telegraph'....

     

     

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Aye, Cameron et al. should stop talking pish. Just makes them look even more stupid.

    Quote

    https://archive.is/CVLVe

    Scotland? One of the most powerful devolved places in the world? Probably not.

    Scotland is about to become "one of the most powerful devolved parliaments in the world".

    That, at least, is the boast of David Cameron. And, brace yourselves, you're going to hear it endlessly over the next couple of months...

    ..The world, after all, is a big, big place and is dotted with semi-independent statelets that pack way more power over their own affairs than Scotland. One, the Faroe Islands, is just off our shores.

    Our northern neighbours - who know us so well they use our political jargon - reckon they have the "Devo Max" we have never quite been offered.

    The Faroese, just as one example, can make sovereign decisions such as whether to be in the European Union or not. Scotland can't...

    ...Some academics have had a bash at putting together a league table, the Regional Autonomy Index. Scotland, needless to say, isn't at the top. Such honours go to places like Spain's Basque Country and Srpska Republika, the Serb-ruled half of divided Bosnia...

    ...Nicola McEwen is a professor of territorial politics at Edinburgh University. I asked her whether Scotland was one of the world's most powerful devolved parliaments. "In terms of self-rule, yes," she said. "In terms of influence over the centre, no."

    And here we get to the heart of the matter: Britain, unlike Canada or Russia or America or Germany, isn't a federation.

    So it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to compare Scotland with, say the tiny US state of Rhode Island, which has the same number of votes in the federal Senate as mighty California.

    There was another political boast just ahead of the independence referendum.

    Scotland, former prime minister Gordon Brown said, would be "as close to federalism as you can have in a nation where one part forms 85 per cent of the population." He, like Mr Cameron, was wrong.

     

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Can't help it....

    I mean when even the BBC are taking the pish...

    Imaged brightened a bit:

    libdemfightback.jpg

    And:

    EDIT

    It's true. There's like 9 people there. Holy guacamole. 

    libdem.jpg

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie
  • Weather Preferences: Cold and snowy or warm and dry
  • Location: Tullynessle/Inverurie

    To be fair, once the cafe finished serving breakfast butties the numbers improved somewhat...

    Personally I don't think it's too bad a turnout for a 'small' party (71 elected representatives in Scotland, compared to the SNPs 525). The only thing that gets me is how they consistently get so much MSM coverage.

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