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Scottish Politics 2011-2017


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Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    IMO the yes movement has pretty much become a laughing stock in the way they have acted in defeat.It's a bit like some tyrannical leader from a despot country in Africa that refuses to step down even though the majority don't want him there.

    Wait, are we talking about David Cameron now?

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    And that ignorant, offensive, rant sums up exactly why the YES campaign failed  

    Good god. What a load of boarish spiteful bile from bad losers has been posted during the night. I actually dread to think how Scotland would be run if this is representative of how the yes vote behav

    I'm disappointed in the lack of grace shown by some across the net in accepting this No vote. A complete lack of any empathy and understanding as to why fellow Scots didn't vote Yes.   I personally

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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    I find it very amusing that people who voted Yes are genuinely thought to be "making a fool of themselves" for keeping a critical eye on Westminster.

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    Posted
  • Location: Live Thame (Oxfordshire), Work Heathrow Airport
  • Location: Live Thame (Oxfordshire), Work Heathrow Airport

    I find it very amusing that people who voted Yes are genuinely thought to be "making a fool of themselves" for keeping a critical eye on Westminster.

    Not making fools of themselves for voting yes but making fools of themselves for the way they have acted since losing the vote. There is nothing to criticise about keeping an eye on Westminister, but the other acts of being a sore loser have been highly foolish and laughable. Any respect that the yes vote had is rapidly being lost IMO. How can the yes voters be respected when quite clearly there is a huge lack of respect for anyone that voted no.

    Edited by No Balls Like Snow Balls
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    Posted
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'

    No, it wouldn't be any economic suicide if they found oil. It be a economic boost. We are still arguing even after the close referendum results.

    It wouldn;t survive long enough. The financial markets would crucify a UDI Scotland. It would be in an austerity wilderness for years with crippling rates of borrowing.

    AS hadnt fully thought through all the currency economics so a UDI Scotland would even worse.

    Edited by kar999
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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    Moving beyond the dire statements relating to Scotland's economy and its people, I thought I'd share a couple of posts from my Facebook newsfeed, each written by a different young person, highlighting how hilarious and satirical the youth of Inverness has become.

    "As SNP membership is confirmed to have risen beyond that of the UK-wide membership of the Liberal Democrats, Nick Clegg opens his second bottle of Pinot Noir. He pours himself his fourth large glass with trembling hands, before drinking it as though it were water to a terminally-dehydrated man. He is only vaguely aware that it is still morning - the concept of time has coalesced into one long eternity of despair for him. He pours himself his fifth glass, oblivious to the echoing drone of David Cameron trying to plow on and discuss devolution proposals, and oblivious to the other cabinet members' looks of heart-wrenching concern. He is oblivious to all but his failings and the hollow warmth that the red wine promises."

    "Surely the first step in youth-based, active Highland politics should be to pen a short novella which describes in meticulous detail Clegg's crushing sense of ennui and existential terror? As the Lib Dem's Scottish electoral heartland, we owe it to the Party to point out how utterly pointless this whole 'life' thing really is. We owe it to Clegg. It might just be his last chance."

    "It's funny how Tony Blair just seems to pop up on various media outlets making comments about everything. He's just like Katie Hopkins, except he's a war criminal."

    More to come!

    Edited by NorthernRab
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    Posted
  • Location: Central Falkirk
  • Location: Central Falkirk

    Now that independence is mainstream, having the support of 45% of the population,

    Its really quite inspiring.

     

     Not quite, SS. Just under 45% of those who voted, so that's 45% of 85%, or just over 38% of the over-15 population. Clearly we can't definitively say what those who didn't bother to vote think about Indy, but surely if they weren't content with the status quo and remaining as part of the union, they'd have joined the ranks of yes supporters? 

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    Posted
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'

    snip ... double posting

    Edited by kar999
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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    Not quite, SS. Just under 45% of those who voted, so that's 45% of 85%, or just over 38% of the over-15 population. Clearly we can't definitively say what those who didn't bother to vote think about Indy, but surely if they weren't content with the status quo and remaining as part of the union, they'd have joined the ranks of yes supporters?

    This rather weak argument works (or rather doesn't) in inverse - by such thinking, most of Scotland didn't vote to keep Scotland in the UK.

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    This rather weak argument works (or rather doesn't) in inverse - by such thinking, most of Scotland didn't vote to keep Scotland in the UK.

    au contraire - the referendum was to leave the UK - if nobody voted at all the status quo would have been retained, by the same token we can assume that those who did not vote had no strong feelings in leaving the union, leaving behind a residue of people who would have liked to have voted but were unable to through circumstances beyond their control such as sickness, dying before the due date or some other pressing reason - we have no realistic way of determining the breakdown of this but it would be safe to assume that a certain number were in fact in the former bracket of not being that concerned, so a difference can be inferred albeit small. 

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Newton Abbot or east Dartmoor, Devon
  • Location: Near Newton Abbot or east Dartmoor, Devon

    The Yes movement is moving on, deal with it.

     

    If you think I'm going to pipe down and get back in my wee Scottish cringe box, you are very much mistaken. 1.6 millions Scots are proud they managed to acheive what they did despite the lies, broken promises, Westminster propoganda machine and having the full weight of th press against them.

     

    We fight on, we fight on to win.

     

    Odd, in an oddly familiar way, choice of words for your last sentence.

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    Posted
  • Location: Now moved to tropical Bradford on Avon
  • Weather Preferences: Cold, snow and summer heatwaves.
  • Location: Now moved to tropical Bradford on Avon

    The Yes movement is moving on, deal with it.

     

    If you think I'm going to pipe down and get back in my wee Scottish cringe box, you are very much mistaken. 1.6 millions Scots are proud they managed to acheive what they did despite the lies, broken promises, Westminster propoganda machine and having the full weight of th press against them.

     

    We fight on, we fight on to win.

     

     

    May I suggest you go watch the Anglophobic historically incorrect Brave heart to cheer yourself up :rofl:

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    Posted
  • Location: North of Falkirk
  • Weather Preferences: North Atlantic cyclogenesis
  • Location: North of Falkirk

    Not making fools of themselves for voting yes but making fools of themselves for the way they have acted since losing the vote.

    Like the NO voters (who won) then decided to a wee riot in George Square under the name of Unionism. I think that's foolish, don't you?

    That's the norm. They like to stoop as low as they can.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Newton Abbot or east Dartmoor, Devon
  • Location: Near Newton Abbot or east Dartmoor, Devon

    Like the NO voters (who won) then decided to a wee riot in George Square under the name of Unionism. I think that's foolish, don't you?

     

    Yup.

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    The Yes movement is moving on, deal with it.

     

    If you think I'm going to pipe down and get back in my wee Scottish cringe box, you are very much mistaken. 1.6 millions Scots are proud they managed to acheive what they did despite the lies, broken promises, Westminster propoganda machine and having the full weight of th press against them.

     

    We fight on, we fight on to win.

    It seems strange that all the lies and the broken promises come from the 'No' side, yet when listening to and watching Alex Salmond and getting the distinct impression that here was the magic fairy who only had to wave his magic wand to make everybody live happily ever after, yet he has made a number of promises which he has been unable to keep - he has fed a dream to the people of Scotland but as I see it, he has only succeeded in dividing the nation.

     

    I can understand Scotland's disenchantment with Whitehall - lets face for a number of Scots, Oslo in Norway is nearer and some the Scots being descendants of the Norse, there is a natural affinity there - but as it is there is no doubt a good argument for allowing Scots to raise more in the way of taxes locally to enable them to administer those matters more local, however some of the taxes will still have to go to central government to support matters which affect us all such as defence.

     

    In some ways things have already changed out of all recognition since, as some would describe, the bad old days of Maggie Thatcher - Scotland now has its own parliament and administers its on welfare and education programs. It has always had its own system of law which is different in many respects to the law of England and Wales.

     

    Perhaps one day Scotland may achieve the independence it desires but in my view this would best be done through mutual agreement rather than by pitting one side against the other.

     

    It does remind of Quebec in Canada - although the British won the battle for these lands, in my view their was understanding and sympathy extended towards the vanquished French of the region in allowing them to retain many aspects of their lives appertaining to France, which included the French Language, albeit a variation of that spoken in France and retained much of the old French Civil Law. They too had a referendum in 1995 where the 'No's' just held the day but they too have nationalists still intent on separation, including one from Montreal who rented my house once who said he detested the Queen's head on the bank notes. But surely it cannot be good for a region to continually have two groups opposed to each other such as this - ok we get the same in the UK between the right and left wings of government but this changes with the odd general election so we just get used to living with the 'other side' in power from time to time.

     

    In my view the pragmatic approach is the most sensible.

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    Posted
  • Location: Highland Scotland
  • Location: Highland Scotland

    Got sent this earlier:

    post-4009-0-29397700-1411511926_thumb.jp

    Was in Weatherspoons for a bit earlier for a couple with a mate, constitutional and political chat still very much the dominant topic of conversation. I am simply astonished by some of the people I know that have joined the SNP (or are still trying to join the SNP!). I do wonder if by next May Westminster might be wishing Scotland had voted YES, we've opened many a can of worms that Westminster, but particularly Labour would rather not deal with.

    Still weighing up the merits of joining the Green Party or the SNP... much trickier decision than where to put the X last Thursday! :p

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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    au contraire - the referendum was to leave the UK - if nobody voted at all the status quo would have been retained, by the same token we can assume that those who did not vote had no strong feelings in leaving the union, leaving behind a residue of people who would have liked to have voted but were unable to through circumstances beyond their control such as sickness, dying before the due date or some other pressing reason - we have no realistic way of determining the breakdown of this but it would be safe to assume that a certain number were in fact in the former bracket of not being that concerned, so a difference can be inferred albeit small.

    Firstly, your initial point is merely semantics. Equally, if they cared so much about retaining the union, they would have shown up.

    There is no logical train of thought which can support the claim that those who didn't vote can be considered no voters. In fact, that's a bit of a terrifying argument.

    Edited by NorthernRab
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    Posted
  • Location: Highland Scotland
  • Location: Highland Scotland

    A woman in the pub came over to us, and placed a small blue yes badge on the table in front of us. She said, “we were here in ’79, we really thought we would get it this time. Next time, we won’t be alive, but you will, and next time you’ll get it. Keep this badge for then.â€

    Our realisation of the importance of the movement we were part of had perhaps never been so poignant – we committed to continuing to work for change and to making it happen.

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    Posted
  • Location: Paris suburbs
  • Location: Paris suburbs

    I wouldn't make too much out of the increased SNP membership. As soon as information like this leaks onto the internet, it will snowball via social media. Understandably, there are thousands of people who're desperate to increase the prominence of anything related to the Yes campaign.

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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    I wouldn't make too much out of the increased SNP membership. As soon as information like this leaks onto the internet, it will snowball via social media. Understandably, there are thousands of people who're desperate to increase the prominence of anything related to the Yes campaign.

    I think it's more the fact that Labour will be drowned by the number of door to door campaigners in future elections.

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    Posted
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)
  • Weather Preferences: Wind driven falling snow
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)

    It seems strange that all the lies and the broken promises come from the 'No' side, yet when listening to and watching Alex Salmond and getting the distinct impression that here was the magic fairy who only had to wave his magic wand to make everybody live happily ever after, yet he has made a number of promises which he has been unable to keep - he has fed a dream to the people of Scotland but as I see it, he has only succeeded in dividing the nation.

     

     

    In many ways the nation was already divided, the whole referendum has only served to bring the divide out from the shadows. It's the elephant in the room scenario. I know a lot of people will disagree, but that's my opinion and I'm sticking to it :)

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
    SNP way ahead in Yougov subsets again this morning with SNP(+PC) on 5% of the UK total. Implies SNP over 50% for Westminster in this sample. Labour 28%.
     
    Ed once again rated worse than Dave, here in terms of list of good qualities. 64% say Ed has none of these, Dave manages 58%.
     
    Polling could be very interesting going into May 2015. This keeps up and it's the end of the British Labour party as a major political force in Scotland.
     
    The consequences of a Labour wipe-out in Scotland at Westminster level would be fascinating. Never mind pro-indy parties would be in majority at both levels, what would Labour MPs do? Would they look to Holyrood  and Scotland for a job? How would sitting MSPs take this threat? Implosion as infighting destroys them?
     
    A Labour wipe out in Scotland and Tory win UK-wide could be very interesting. Was the 2010 Tory win that gave us our first iref. What happens if the SNP are UK king makers? That would be hilarious.
     
    Interestingly, BBC sources saying both BT and Yes had internal polling showing Yes ahead on 53% and it was that which promoted The Vow.
     
    I guess any future indy moves will depend largely on polling. Y/N polling shall continue, just as it has all my life. If circumstances create a situation (e.g. folk give up on promise of powers, Tories return) and Yes goes ahead (e.g. just by continuation of long term trends leading up to voting day), we will likely find ourselves voting once more. If people want it, it will happen. If not, it won't. Simple democracy.
     
    Meantime, this promise, preserved in just about every newspaper, is expected to be kept.

    The specific pledge which appeared on the front pages last Tuesday comprised a guarantee of the continuation of the Barnett Formula for public spending, a promise that the NHS here would not be undermined by privatisation south of the Border, that the Scottish Parliament would be entrenched as a sovereign entity and that it should acquire extensive new powers over taxation, borrowing and welfare. 
     

     

     
    While YesAlliance parties continue to grow their army ahead of May 2015.

    It's a new dawn. It's a new day. It's a new 31,601 @theSNP members. Total now 57,243. And I'm feeling good. Join in:

     

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Wait a minute, didn't Labour / Lamont save the union for eternity?

     

    How come the knives are out already?

     

    http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/referendum-news/murphy-backed-for-leadership-but-lamont-has-no-intention-of-resigning.25414376

     

    Labour MPs say Lamont should step aside and be replaced by Murphy
     
    A NUMBER of Labour MPs believe Johann Lamont should step aside as Scottish leader and make way for Jim Murphy to take the fight to the SNP.
     
    MP vs MSP infighting beginning in earnest?
     
    10635839_798914660152504_453553879277757
    Edited by scottish skier
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    Reference the new up take in SNP membership. I think this has a great deal to do with the "safety in numbers" analogy. By creating an entity larger than oneself, you have a better chance to be heard and taken more seriously. This has been born out of campaigning and engaging in politics, also reading impartial material via the social media. SNP increased membership will also make Westminster sit up and take note that the people in Scotland are watching them...this is my take on the evolution of politics in Scotland.

     

    One further point, I was going to suggest last week that as soon as there is a "NO" vote in the referendum we will see Westminster looking at going to fight in Syria and Iraq...just wish I had mentioned it...this scenario in north Africa looks stage planned does it not?

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    Posted
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet

    The SNP membership is not a surprise given how well they motivated ground forced for the referendum.

    A better indication of whether we should take notice will probably be 2017 (if a non Tory government) or 2018 (if a Tory government).

    If the SNP membership is still even slowly increasing then (there should be no real publicity) then its something to worry about. Otherwise, I imagine that they'd just start to leak members once the fever over a referendum passes.

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