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Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    William Bain MP Labour Party via twitter:

    There is a long-standing PLP convention that we do not support SNP motions - we will oppose the Finance Bill & lay amendments

    Childish.

    Aye, the SNP could table a motion in support of world peace and the Labour party would still oppose it. Their hatred for the SNP, who filled the centre (to modest left) void left by Labour, is killing them. They have no policy nor direction in Scotland; just continuous bile directed at the SNP.

    Whit's going on with Lord Forsyth btw. After continuing to add a flurry of ludicrous ammendments to the Scotland bill - all of which will be ingored following agreement with the Scottish and Westminster governments - he's now saying this:

    http://newsnetscotla...ayed-by-the-snp

    Forsyth: Unionist parties a "shambles" and are being "played" by the SNP

    Arch-unionist Michael Forsyth has expressed his belief that we are now close to the point where independence is in both Scotland and England's interests and has denounced the unionist parties for being in a "shambles"......

    He continued: "The unionist parties are a shambles, they can't even get their campaign together and meanwhile Alex Salmond has got £2 million pounds in the bank and will have a very successful local elections, and he will be off. All this appeasement has been hugely damaging."

    Addressing himself to Lib Dem and Labour supporters of devolution, Mr Forsyth said:

    "You guys said, if we have devolution it will kill nationalism stone dead, you designed the Scottish Parliament so that no party could ever get a majority and you laughed at people like me who said it would lead to the Nationalists getting control of the Parliament and it will lead to resentment and the break up of the Union and this is where we are now. I admit, I didn't think it would happen quite so quickly."

    ----------------

    EDIT. And yet another Labour councillor resigns from the party in Glasgow.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk...w-west-17535373

    The word is that Labour, the Tories and the Libs are already generally accepting they are likely going to be slaughtered in the May council elections. Ruthy has openly stated similar to Lord Forsyth's comments above.

    ------------------

    EDIT

    OMG. Just when you thought you had seen it all.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9170134/Alex-Salmonds-secret-tea-party-with-1-million-lottery-donors.html

    You can see why Lord Forsyth reckons the game is up. This is what the unionist parties are trying to smear the SNP with. I wonder what Chris and Colin Weir have lobbied for - maybe for, erm, let me think about it, must be...hmmm..independence for Scotland? Well, I guess AS will do his best to ensure that happens for them. Aye.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    And that ignorant, offensive, rant sums up exactly why the YES campaign failed  

    Good god. What a load of boarish spiteful bile from bad losers has been posted during the night. I actually dread to think how Scotland would be run if this is representative of how the yes vote behav

    I'm disappointed in the lack of grace shown by some across the net in accepting this No vote. A complete lack of any empathy and understanding as to why fellow Scots didn't vote Yes.   I personally

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    http://www.bbc.co.uk...otland-17548765

    One third of Scotland's energy needs coming from renewables

    Scotland is now generating more than a third of its electricity from renewable sources, according to new figures.

    The Scottish government's target for 2011 was to meet 31% of the country's energy needs from renewables.

    If consumption remains at the 2010 level, they will have accounted for 35% of electricity needs.

    Energy Minister Fergus Ewing said "great progress" was being made towards the longer-term goal of meeting the equivalent of 100% of gross annual electricity demand from renewables by 2020.

    "Projects representing £750m of investment were switched on in 2011, with an investment pipeline of £46bn," he said.

    Good news. New pumped storage being planned for the Great Glen. Ideal combo with wind.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk...slands-17061075

    Tie Scotlands offshore wind into Norway's hydro pumped storage capacity via the planned Northconnect interconnector and it will make an ideal renewables partnership for supplying Europe (e.g. via both England and Denmark-Germany).

    http://www.northconnect.no/

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    And another one bites the dust; this time in midlothian.

    http://www.scotsman.com/news/majority-lost-as-councillor-quits-labour-1-2206253

    Majority lost as councillor quits Labour

    Jeez, I only got my polling card today and they're already dropping like flies.

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    Posted
  • Location: Odiham, Hampshire
  • Location: Odiham, Hampshire

    Of course WS. That group of Scotsmen were noted for signing the treaty of union after receiving large bribes to do so. Today, you can see them sitting in the house of commons voting to, e.g. introduce higher eduction tuition fees for English students while their parties support these being government funded/their children don't have to pay at home. There's even unelected ones in the House of Lords wearing ermine coats doing similar undemocratic things. They are members of the Tory, Labour and Liberal parties.

    Of course everyone is entitled to an opinion. However, those that form the British government, notably those not elected in Scotland, should take note of this:

    The States Parties to the present Covenant, including those having responsibility for the administration of Non-Self-Governing and Trust Territories, shall promote the realization of the right of self-determination, and shall respect that right, in conformity with the provisions of the Charter of the United Nations.

    http://www2.ohchr.or...sh/law/ccpr.htm

    Dave, Theresa, Trimble et al should be bi-partisan, acting only to facilitate/promote Scots self-determination, for that is what we are dealing with and they don't live in Scotland nor will be voting in the referendum. Even Scots MPs (excluding the SNP) and Lords (no SNP) really should not involve themselves in a professional capacity as they have an obvious conflict of interest.

    ----------------

    EDIT. Unrelated, but an interesting move towards ensuring all the decision making in Scotland is not centralised to the urban areas of Edinburgh, Glasgow etc.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk...otland-17499075

    Plans for Scottish rural parliament

    The Scottish government is moving ahead with plans to create a rural parliament for Scotland.

    Ministers said it would offer "a greater voice to rural communities" but would not be a further layer of government.

    Scotland's history is one of imperial failure prior the the Act of Union, followed by magnificent imperial success once it was part of the Union. Like virtually all countries in Europe during the 17th century, Scotland was nakedly ambitious when it came to empire building. There is no doubt that Scotsmen were, per capita, the most successful builders of the Empire once Scotland joined the Union.

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    Posted
  • Location: Odiham, Hampshire
  • Location: Odiham, Hampshire

    Isn't it funny how so many non Scots or people from outwith Scotland seem to know more about what is good for us than we do. This has been the case for 300 years. David Trimble is a very sinister Unionist. He loosely disguises what is in fact an anti-Irish form of Britishness. Anyway he has helped screw up Northern Ireland to suit his agenda like so many over there. So David please keep your nose out of our country. The decent non sectarian Scots who form the overall majority do not need lessons on history from your neck of the woods. Yes I have been to Belfast. They may have cleaned up the city but the tensions and divisions remain. But this is just typical of the unionists attitude of divide and rule. Catholics and protestants get along fine here other than some old firm hard liners. Highlanders, lowlanders and islanders all have their differences but we are all Scottish.

    Strong sectarian feelings fester just under the surface in Scotland. The Union has helped to subdue these feelings, however it may well be a very different story once the Independence debate heats up.

    An example of how an apparently unified nation disintegrates into the most awful bloodbath is Yugoslavia. Will Independence unleash these 'hidden' divides in Scotland?

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    Posted
  • Location: Odiham, Hampshire
  • Location: Odiham, Hampshire

    And another one bites the dust; this time in midlothian.

    http://www.scotsman....abour-1-2206253

    Majority lost as councillor quits Labour

    Jeez, I only got my polling card today and they're already dropping like flies.

    There is no balance to any of your posts. Is there no doubt in your mind? Is there no merit to any of the points made by those that oppose Independence?

    Your relentless certainty weakens the validity of your arguments in the eyes of the undecided.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    There is no balance to any of your posts. Is there no doubt in your mind? Is there no merit to any of the points made by those that oppose Independence?

    Your relentless certainty weakens the validity of your arguments in the eyes of the undecided.

    I have only one vote, just like everyone else. My opinion is just one of many.

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    Posted
  • Location: Camborne
  • Location: Camborne

    Have you got a prominent place in your museum for George Galloway SS? If we can vote in idiots like this then there is no hope. It's a sad reflection on the way things are going in this country.

    George Galloway has tragically demonstrated that sectarian politics are now alive and well in Britain. The other week Ken Livingstone appeared at a London mosque and promised to make London a ‘beacon of Islam’ and last week went on to dismiss Jews as unlikely to vote Labour because they are ‘rich’. Now we see Galloway flying in to one of the country’s most divided areas to sweep the Labour party aside in what he has termed ‘a Bradford spring.’

    Much can — and should — be said about this depressing, and predictable, turn of events. But for now I’d just like to make two quick observations.

    The first regards the ‘Bradford spring’ phrase. This cannot be allowed to go uncommented upon. Of course Galloway is the type of politician — like Livingstone — who can get away with anything. But even for him that phrase gives chutzpah a bad name.

    Whatever the final results across the Middle East and North Africa, during the ‘Arab Spring’ the peoples of the region have risen up in popular moments to overthrow the dictators who have held power over them. The snag is that Galloway has invariably been on the side of the dictators rather than the people who are trying to overthrow them.

    In Iraq he famously told Saddam Hussein,

    Saddam Hussein killed more Muslims than any other leader in modern times.

    In 2005 he turned up in Damascus to praise the insurgency in Iraq, met Bashar al-Assad and told the Syrian people afterwards, ‘I was very, very impressed. … Syria is lucky to have Bashar al-Assad as her President.’ The citizens of Homs and other Syrian cities may well feel otherwise.

    And, of course, in recent years he has turned to Saddam’s old enemies, the regime in Iran, having worked for Press TV, the propaganda arm of the Iranian government which was recently stripped of its broadcasting license by Ofcom. Galloway was content with working for this propaganda outfit whilst it was gunning down the Iranian people on Iranian streets in the aftermath of the ‘Green Revolution’. Shortly afterwards, when Galloway performed a

    with the dictator of Iran himself, Galloway started by telling the grinning ‘President’ Ahmadinejad, ‘I have police protection in London from the Iranian opposition because of my support for your election campaign. I mention this so you know where I’m coming from.’ Indeed.

    All other aspects of the comparison aside, had any kind of ‘Spring’ come to Bradford it would have heralded the popular overthrow of George Galloway, not his election.

    Which brings me to my second point. Galloway is right about one thing —this is certainly what happens when the mainstream parties take their voters for granted. Over recent days Westminster politics has been dominated by a discussion about pasties and a wholly fake personality competition about which party leader had eaten one most recently. Every time Westminster politicians try to appear closer to the people they end up seeming more remote. To that extent Galloway has done everybody a favour. He has reminded us that beyond the increasingly silly and similar Westminster politics there are murmurs going on in this country which the mainstream parties would be very foolish indeed to continue to ignore.

    http://www.spectator...ways-grin.thtml

    Edited by weather ship
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Have you got a prominent place in your museum for George Galloway SS? If we can vote in idiots like this then there is no hope. It's a sad reflection on the way things are going in this country.

    http://www.spectator...ways-grin.thtml

    While I would normally be pleased to see more independents taking seats, I have to agree with you on George Galloway. Another rather embarrassing Scots export.

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    Posted
  • Location: New York City
  • Location: New York City

    Strong sectarian feelings fester just under the surface in Scotland. The Union has helped to subdue these feelings, however it may well be a very different story once the Independence debate heats up.

    An example of how an apparently unified nation disintegrates into the most awful bloodbath is Yugoslavia. Will Independence unleash these 'hidden' divides in Scotland?

    You'd love to see that I'm sure.

    However you are completely out of touch. Being "Scottish" elicits the kind of pride which overcomes differences and unites people.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    You'd love to see that I'm sure.

    However you are completely out of touch. Being "Scottish" elicits the kind of pride which overcomes differences and unites people.

    He's just projecting.

    Sectarianism is of course a fine 'British' institution, with the most loyal unionists in Scotland (~5% who support an end to Holyrood and a return to a unitary British State) being the Conservative & Unionist party faithful of the venerable Orange Order. That's why the Tories had David Trimble up for their conference in Troon (gave a lovely speech about his feelings of 'violence' with respect to Scottish independence and identity); they have close links to sectarianism as its promotion has helped preserve the union through the classic tactic of division.

    Of course we've been through all this before, but here's those lovely unionists with their union jacks and pics of the queen. Very unifying! Of course many have arrived on the morning ferry along with the other lot flying the tricolour. Not a saltire in sight....

    Posted Image

    And of course this must be the 'unifying' force of Britain he was on about.

    Posted Image

    Not Berlin of course, but in good old blighty.

    EDIT. Here are those groups/parties most supportive of the union:

    Conservative & Unionist Party

    British National Party

    UKIP

    DUP, UUP, PUP (all of which have various links to paramilitary groups historically)

    Orange Order

    E/S Defense Leagues

    I wonder if they will all share a platform together campaigning against Scottish independence?

    EDIT2.

    One might contrast the beliefs of a lot of the above listed groups with this, from the SNP party code of conduct:

    (6) Every member has a responsibility not to discriminate on the ground of race, colour, gender, religious belief or non-belief or sexual orientation.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Beccles, Suffolk.
  • Weather Preferences: Thunder, snow, heat, sunshine...
  • Location: Beccles, Suffolk.

    You'd love to see that I'm sure.

    However you are completely out of touch. Being "Scottish" elicits the kind of pride which overcomes differences and unites people.

    Aye, and it's a pity that nationalists down here appear so loath to adopt those values, too...

    He's just projecting.

    Sectarianism is of course a fine 'British' institution, with the most loyal unionists in Scotland (~5% who support an end to Holyrood and a return to a unitary British State) being the Conservative & Unionist party faithful of the venerable Orange Order. That's why the Tories had David Trimble up for their conference in Troon (gave a lovely speech about his feelings of 'violence' with respect to Scottish independence and identity); they have close links to sectarianism as its promotion has helped preserve the union through the classic tactic of division.

    Of course we've been through all this before, but here's those lovely unionists with their union jacks and pics of the queen. Very unifying! Of course many have arrived on the morning ferry along with the other lot flying the tricolour. Not a saltire in sight....

    Posted Image

    And of course this must be the 'unifying' force of Britain he was on about.

    Posted Image

    Not Berlin of course, but in good old blighty.

    EDIT. Here are those groups/parties most supportive of the union:

    Conservative & Unionist Party

    British National Party

    UKIP

    DUP, UUP, PUP (all of which have various links to paramilitary groups historically)

    Orange Order

    E/S Defense Leagues

    I wonder if they will all share a platform together campaigning against Scottish independence?

    EDIT2.

    One might contrast the beliefs of a lot of the above listed groups with this, from the SNP party code of conduct:

    (6) Every member has a responsibility not to discriminate on the ground of race, colour, gender, religious belief or non-belief or sexual orientation.

    A 'rogues' gallery?

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    Posted
  • Location: Camborne
  • Location: Camborne

    While I would normally be pleased to see more independents taking seats, I have to agree with you on George Galloway. Another rather embarrassing Scots export.

    This is the wrong thread but it's a sad, and worrying, reflection on the state of politics in England.

    Posted Image

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    Posted
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level

    With regards to Scottish sectarianism. The anti catholic mentality was developed at the time of the reformation. However modern sectarianism in Scotland is strongly linked to Britains anti Irish stance since the end of the 19th and early 20th century. In Scotland when large numbers of Irish immigrated to Scotland. Protestant Scots wrapped themselves in Union Jacks and Royalty. The anti Irish pro British agenda will slowly dwindle into small pockets of fundamentalsits once Scotland becomes independent. The problem we have at the moment is that Unionists think that singing rule Britannia and waving Ulster and Butchers Aprons in defiance of Scotland,reland and Catholics is legitimate while we remain trapped in the old empire. So modern sectarianism is a British disease in Scotland. In an independent Scotland their behaviour will not be seen as legitimate and the Saltire will rightly replace England's flag!

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    LOL. It's true. I've been saying this all along; the Tories really don't want us!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk...litics-17574289

    Peter Cruddas secretly taped making Tory Union claims

    Footage has emerged of Peter Cruddas saying the Tories need to be seen as fighting to keep the Union even if they do not agree with it. The former Conservative Party chairman is seen making the claim in tapes secretly recorded by the Sunday Times.

    They know it's going to happen at some point anyway - gone too far now; Westminster has been fighting this since the 70's. I did wonder how the Scotland bill was so easily slipped through by the two respective governments and then there's Lord Forsyths comments the other day about inevitability..... Lots going on behind closed doors I imagine. After all, so long as Scotland keeps supplying oil and power etc at a decent price, then what's the big issue; best part on friendly terms.

    This is smoking! In the times, the BBC, STV....

    http://news.stv.tv/politics/302147-conservatives-are-faking-their-opposition-to-independence-to-position-themselves-for-a-post-independence-deal/

    "Speaking to an undercover reporter, Mr Cruddas said: "He (David Cameron) told me that he wants to fight to keep the union ... he told me that was, those were his true feelings, however, even if they’re not, we as a party have to be seen to be fighting to keep the Union together. Even if we don’t agree with it, because at the end of it all, if the Scots say we’re out of here and they want to go independent, we can turn around and say it’s not what we wanted, it’s not what we campaigned for, you can’t have this, you can’t have that, and you can get on with it."

    Yep, better get the groundwork done on who gets what, make things as smooth as possible. A 'no' vote needs no prep work, a 'yes' vote needs lots.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    The above must be true. Look at this:

    http://news.stv.tv/scotland/302188-fury-as-uk-government-threatens-new-irn-bru-tax/

    Fury as UK government threatens new 'Irn-Bru' tax

    Scots face a "crippling" increase in the price of Irn-Bru after the UK Government imposed a special regional tax on carbonated soft drinks.

    The new levy will come on top of VAT and could raise the minimum price of a can of the fizzy drink to over £1.

    You can take our lives but you'll never take oor bru!

    SS, 1 st April, 2012.

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    Posted
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet

    Oh no, they are making you pay more for acid with no discernible benefit..

    Pah, while i would rather there was no tax it is stuff like this which i would rather was taxed.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    http://www.bbc.co.uk...litics-17600791

    Call me cynical but I expect the Westminster version of this consultation would attract those of a unionist persuasion biasing the poll and making a nice headline for the BBC.

    You would be entirely correct; that’s why Westminster had received 3000 responses (750 from a pre-filled form on the Labour party website incidentally) and the Scottish Government have received ~12000 now; 4x the amount so far.

    People wanting Devo Max/Independence are writing to the Scottish Government, those wishing the status quo to Westminster. Of course there will be a decent few exceptions to this, but the fact that 70% of Scots want Devo Max, with 24% wanting the status quo in recent polls; it is thus hardly surprising that only 20% of responses went to Westminster. All rather embarrassing for them really. They don't seem to understand that the Scottish Government is the Scottish Government these days, not them anymore.

    The Labour fuss over the anonymous submission possibility meaning 'cybernats' were submitting multiple consultations to sway the result was hilarious; they called for parliament to be recalled and everything. Only 3.5% of submissions were anonymous with no evidence that these were duplicates. Westminster got the same at 3.3% anonymous. Labour don't even need to try and be silly/desperate looking these days - comes naturally.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    I was reading the Scottish news this morning and was asked my opinion regarding the Scottish news website and coverage from the BBC. Wasted no time in letting them know how poor the coverage was and how biased the reporting was towards unionist opinions. Also went on to say that I no longer trusted the BBC in reporting unbiased news and the BBC was spouting lies and unionist propoganda.

    The BBC are disgraceful and makes me wonder what else they lie about. We no longer live in a democracy, as we have to choose between bunch of political parties that are all self serving, but Scotland will after 2014.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    The BBC are disgraceful and makes me wonder what else they lie about. We no longer live in a democracy, as we have to choose between bunch of political parties that are all self serving, but Scotland will after 2014.

    Yes, while everyone knows newspapers have their particular leanings so are expected to spin things in a favourable way for them, the BBC is supposed to be impartial and Scots pay their license fees just like everyone else.

    Interestingly, in terms of Scottish independence debate, London BBC is more biased in a primarily ignorant type of way; presenters often appear to know nothing about Scotland and come up with all sorts of rubbish because of that; when given facts by, e.g. SNP MPs etc, they seem flummoxed mostly. But then the centre of their world is not Scotland so we can understand this to an extent.

    BBC Scotland, Pacific Quay, Glasgow, is Glasgow Labour is a very different kettle of fish. Presenters and editorial staff are dominated by members of the Labour Party/people close to them as Scotland has been dominated by Labour for decades. They are the ones who are really acting like propagandists for the unionist cause.

    It’s not working however. While it has grown as support for the SNP has grown over the years, since May 2011 it has become so blindingly obvious that it is working against them; people in Scotland can see what is happening in the MSM and this is driving up support for independence, rather than suppressing it as intended.

    You are perfectly correct in that a large part of what is happening in Scotland is a rejection of the British political establishment and a hope for something better. The way the British establishment has reacted to the prospect of an independence referendum is only serving to reinforce people’s belief that this is the best thing to do.

    I do hope that it brings about change in England too – certainly it could not be carry on as usual if Scotland leaves (or ends up in some sort of Devo Maxx situation); too many implications including status of Wales, N. Ireland, a parliament for England? Federalism?... That is why Westminster is terrified; their empirical relic self-serving political establishment is crumbling before their eyes.

    While it seems the Tories have conceded that Scottish independence is inevitable, I think they are wrong to believe that this will allow them to carry on as usual with the old FPTP system giving them increased majorities without Scotland. Rather, I think they don’t give the electorate south of the border enough credit. I would suggest instead we will witness the rise of new/smaller parties and a move towards PR in less time than people might expect. The little revolution in Scotland may yet spark a larger one in England when the electorate of the latter see it is possible to change things for the better….

    EDIT This from the fastest growing news site (voluntary/supported by donations etc) in Scotland this morning on BBC bias...

    http://newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-opinion/4716-proving-bbc-bias-in-scotland

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    Posted
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet

    Scottish independence will not affect the rise of small parties in England however i imagine within a decade that Labour will support the Liberal Democrats in calling for STV (not proportional enough in my opinion, i want the full party list system).

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  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Scottish independence will not affect the rise of small parties in England however i imagine within a decade that Labour will support the Liberal Democrats in calling for STV (not proportional enough in my opinion, i want the full party list system).

    Party list means you don't get a local MP, which is considered my many a disadvantage. In Scotland, the Alternative Member System gives you FPTP on the first vote, keeping your local MP, then your second vote (regional list) is used to make things more proportional. At the moment, the counting method on the second vote does not give perfect PR but should be very close most of the time. However, there are other methods which can improve this to make it as good as party list PR in terms of proportionality.

    Yes, you are possibly quite right about a Lab-Lib dem pact. The problem is if Lab our look like getting a majority under FPTP they may be less keen.....

    Either way, having a government that actually closely represents the electorate is far more healthy. At the moment you have people who are e.g. not happy with Labour going too far to the right but nervous if they don't vote for them then the Tories will win aided by FPTP.

    I often wonder what would have happenend if e.g. PR meant Thatcher did not have a majority so had to compromise somewhat with Labour/the left. Some of her policies would have been implimented (e.g. closing down old industry that was no longer profitable) but others not, e.g. English water may have stayed in public hands, more investment would have been made in Labour supporting areas..., the UK may not have become so polarised/divided. We would not likely have seen the rise of New Labour (and it spending/borrowing like mad to still appeal to the left while being right) and still have Liberals in the centre looking out for civil liberty. While that may not be a Tory wet dream, neither would it be a lefty one, nor a liberal one either, but rather strong policy built on consensus. Who knows, we might have be living in a federal UK with e.g. Scots quite content with that....

    I'm afraid we've become to impatient up here for that now though - now that we've tasted something much more representative, we want more and now! :D

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet

    It is true that you would not have an official MP however after the party list vote you could then divide England by the number of MPs and appoint them by party to the region with the strongest vote share for each party. You could then still have an appointed MP, just not one who could be elected directly.

    STV is supposed to be the most semi-proportional system with an average disproportional index of less than 4% as opposed to about 10% for AMS+FPTP and near 20% for FPTP.

    Personally i am all for Scotland having fiscal autonomy (minus say 10% for national infrastructure projects and defense) but am actually against you guys making your own laws. Wales is an example of making your own laws being bad, they now have Welsh as compulsory language despite the fact that it will not be spoken outside a 100 mile radius, what a waste of money.

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