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Scottish Politics 2011-2017


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Posted
  • Location: North of Falkirk
  • Weather Preferences: North Atlantic cyclogenesis
  • Location: North of Falkirk

    Let's take it off tangent, but still very real..

     

    I'm a YES voter and absolute with it. However, I do worry the end result of the referendum might be 51-49% to either side.

     

    What happens next...because that's a hell of lot of people peeved off either way..

     

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    And that ignorant, offensive, rant sums up exactly why the YES campaign failed  

    Good god. What a load of boarish spiteful bile from bad losers has been posted during the night. I actually dread to think how Scotland would be run if this is representative of how the yes vote behav

    I'm disappointed in the lack of grace shown by some across the net in accepting this No vote. A complete lack of any empathy and understanding as to why fellow Scots didn't vote Yes.   I personally

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    Posted
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)
  • Weather Preferences: Wind driven falling snow
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)

    Maybe people should stop calling everyone fascists every five seconds, I feel this thread was here at the same point last night  :pardon:

     

    I think he has a point, how much do you know about the Orangemen?

    Edited by CatchMyDrift
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    Posted
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level

    Fascism is hatred of another religion ,creed or nationality.What part of that description doesn't fit the Orange Order.Have you witnessed these people in action they are truly scary people.What are we to call them misguided!

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    Posted
  • Location: North of Falkirk
  • Weather Preferences: North Atlantic cyclogenesis
  • Location: North of Falkirk

    I don't read the Daily Mail but I certainly don't think that Alex Salmond is a great politician. I have no hatred against him, nor against any Scots who choose to vote yes. But I do think that Alex Salmond is a great soundbite politician who will say what his followers will want to hear. There has been a long enough time for him to plan an exact monetary plan if the yes vote goes through and I am intrigued to why this has not occurred. For me, he should have stuck his neck out, and devised a plan for an independent Scottish pound (to be truly Independent) and provided a manifesto in this respect to educate the electorate and let them know the pros and cons of this. I can't understand why such a crucial part of Independence will not be addressed until after the vote. Surely the Scottish electorate need to know this prior to making a decision?

    C'mon, Salmond (love him or hate) has seen off successive Labour and Tory PMs. He's (currently) the only UK politician worth salt who could debate (sensibly) with the lot of them.

     

    We will use the pound. End of. 

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    Posted
  • Location: Peterborough
  • Weather Preferences: Snow and frost in the winter. Hot and sunny, thunderstorms in the summer.
  • Location: Peterborough

    Fascism is hatred of another religion ,creed or nationality.What part of that description doesn't fit the Orange Order.Have you witnessed these people in action they are truly scary people.What are we to call them misguided!

    Supremacist is probably a better word to describe the orange order I think.

    That being said, unfortunately they have a right (freedom of speak) to spout their rubbish. It's for others to simply be the better man (or woman) and ignore their message. Shout insults and wanting banishment for them means you stoop to a lower level. Unfortunately that seems to be the level of politics these days (or to put it, the least worst argument wins).

    @Catchmydrift my post was partially in response to a comment made yesterday that I queried about the debate with George Galloway and the "nazi" comments. I never really got a reply to that and any independent source I found online including wings had subsequently edited that part of the story out. Which was odd to say the least.

    Edited by Captain shortwave
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    Posted
  • Location: Stockport
  • Location: Stockport

    Fascism is hatred of another religion ,creed or nationality.What part of that description doesn't fit the Orange Order.Have you witnessed these people in action they are truly scary people.What are we to call them misguided!

     

    My Scouse Dad has told me they didn't tend to get a good reception (to say the least!) in the bombed out remains of (largely Catholic) post-war Liverpool. Many a brick were chucked, apparently.

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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    Well, I didn't expect that. There's nor roonm for sectarianism in this debate. Shame on you.

    The Orange Order are almost universally scorned in Scotland, by Protestants and Catholics alike.

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    Posted
  • Location: Hayward’s Heath - home, Brighton/East Grinstead - work.
  • Weather Preferences: Snow and storms
  • Location: Hayward’s Heath - home, Brighton/East Grinstead - work.

    C'mon, Salmond (love him or hate) has seen off successive Labour and Tory PMs. He's (currently) the only UK politician worth salt who could debate (sensibly) with the lot of them.

     

    We will use the pound. End of. 

    A foolish and perhaps arrogant stance to take hey? Because if the YES vote wins and we put it to the rest of the UK whether or not Scotland should be allowed to use the pound as their currency I pretty much know what we will vote. End of ...... sterling in Scotland.

     

     

    However, I don't see that using the current British pound is critical to the yes vote, but having a manifesto that determines clearly what the alternative is and how it will work, should be.

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    Posted
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level

    I also think they have tried to present a veneer of respectability in Scotland/We don't really hate Catholics anymore but their theme tune is.Hello Hello We are the billy boys ...you'll know us by our noise...up to our knees in Fenian blood.Nice!Anyway I think whatever description they are not nice people and most fair minded people would agree.

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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    A foolish and perhaps arrogant stance to take hey? Because if the YES vote wins and we put it to the rest of the UK whether or not Scotland should be allowed to use the pound as their currency I pretty much know what we will vote. End of ...... sterling in Scotland.

     

     

    However, I don't see that using the current British pound is critical to the yes vote, but having a manifesto that determines clearly what the alternative is and how it will work, should be.

    Westminster are known for putting serious issues to the electorate in referenda.p

    In saying that, I hope Scotland leaving inspires considerable political reform.

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    Posted
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level

    The currency won't go to a vote.Cameron will be bricking it from the markets.The last thing he will want is Scotland's oil tax out of BOE balance of payments.Red carpet will come to Holyrood.If they really did say no then its Sterlingisation for 5 years and then Scottish pound.Either way using Sterling is a stop gap.Max 10 years then bye bye Sterling.

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    Posted
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'
  • Location: Sth Staffs/Shrops 105m/345' & NW Snowdonia 219m/719'

    Pesto this evening...

     

    attachicon.gifPesto.PNG

     

    Deliberate leak to catch Newsnight and stoke fears on the markets overnight to amplify the impact into the next day print run of UK papers.

     

     

    Just surreal, wonder how many folks will have had their eyes opened to the gross manipulation of the media by Uk Govt.

     

    There is no great media conspiracy theory. There has been fear in the markets for some time and especially so after last Monday's poll, There has also been speculation and talk of contingency plans for Banks and financial institutions relocating for a number of months. Follow the worldwide independent financial media not the Beeb, or the general press.

     

    From FE Trustnet

     

    Seven companies with significant exposure to Scotland saw more than £4bn wiped off their balance sheets when one poll had the “Yes†campaign ahead on Monday.

    These include the likes of Aberdeen Asset Management, Lloyds, Babcock, Standard Life and Royal Bank of Scotland.

     

    “Most of these companies have made back some ground since then, but a win for Alex Salmond could see these stocks fall again,â€

     

    20140911_scot_1.png

     

    Edited by kar999
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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    I also think they have tried to present a veneer of respectability in Scotland/We don't really hate Catholics anymore but their theme tune is.Hello Hello We are the billy boys ...you'll know us by our noise...up to our knees in Fenian blood.Nice!Anyway I think whatever description they are not nice people and most fair minded people would agree.

    Especially considering that the Fein / Fingalians includes Highlanders. A detail they like to ignore.

    For example, famous Highland song Canan nan Gaidheal.

    Thig thugainn, thig co-rium gu siar

    Gus an cluinn sinn ann cànan nam Féinn

    Thig thugainn, thig co-rium gu siar

    Gus an cluinn sinn ann cànan nan Gàidheal

    Translation:

    Come, come with me to the West,

    Until we hear the tongue of the Fein,

    Come, come with me to the West,

    Until we hear the tongue of the Gaels.

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    Posted
  • Location: NR LOURDES SW FRANCE
  • Location: NR LOURDES SW FRANCE

    C'mon, Salmond (love him or hate) has seen off successive Labour and Tory PMs. He's (currently) the only UK politician worth salt who could debate (sensibly) with the lot of them.

     

    We will use the pound. End of. 

    Don't the Scottish people deserve a vote on this? Do you mean sterlingization? That certainly should be voted on, why haven't the Scottish people been given more information as to the pro's and con's of that.

     

    For all my criticisms of BT, Yes IMO have been found wanting on the currency issue.

     

    Salmonds give me a mandate to take to Westminster for a CU was forgetting one big problem, a CU won't go anywhere unless rUK voters agree to it.

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    Posted
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)
  • Weather Preferences: Wind driven falling snow
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)

    Supremacist is probably a better word to describe the orange order I think.

    That being said, unfortunately they have a right (freedom of speak) to spout their rubbish. It's for others to simply be the better man (or woman) and ignore their message. Shout insults and wanting banishment for them means you stoop to a lower level. Unfortunately that seems to be the level of politics these days (or to put it, the least worst argument wins).

    @Catchmydrift my post was partially in response to a comment made yesterday that I queried about the debate with George Galloway and the "nazi" comments. I never really got a reply to that and any independent source I found online including wings had subsequently edited that part of the story out. Which was odd to say the least.

     

    I never saw any of the debate in question so can't comment, I only read about it on here which is third hand at best :)

     

    There is a right to a freedom of speech, but not for an organisation which has such strong links with terrorists. The then leader of the Orange Order in Scotland is quoted as saying in an interview in 2001 that they would form a paramilitary force to resist Scottish independence. I'm not sure what their viewpoint is now. The Orange Order had very strong links with the loyalist paramilitaries in Northern Ireland and Scotland over many decades, the two were intertwined as to be one and the same. Would you support a group's "freedom of speech" if it was intertwined with al-Qaeda?

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    Posted
  • Location: Odiham, Hampshire
  • Location: Odiham, Hampshire

    When everybody was proud of being Scottish there was

    Jim Baxter

    Dennis Law

    Bobby Lennox

    Colin Stein

    Billy Mc Neil

    Jimmy Johnstone

    Charlie Cooke

    Danny Mc Graine

    David Hay

    Willie Miller

    Gordon Strachan

    Gordon McQueen

    Alan Hansen

    Kenny Dalglish

    Archie Gemmill

    Graham Souness

    Ally McCoist

    Now there is a possibility of independence there is Duncan Fletcher.

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    Posted
  • Location: Peterborough
  • Weather Preferences: Snow and frost in the winter. Hot and sunny, thunderstorms in the summer.
  • Location: Peterborough

    I also think they have tried to present a veneer of respectability in Scotland/We don't really hate Catholics anymore but their theme tune is.Hello Hello We are the billy boys ...you'll know us by our noise...up to our knees in Fenian blood.Nice!Anyway I think whatever description they are not nice people and most fair minded people would agree.

    Very true, to be honest the likes of these groups have steadily been driven into irrelevance since the ever increasing move to a secular society.

     

    On the currency union, whilst you may argue about the markets how how Cameron would bow to pressure, you have to remember that there has to be public support south of the border for it to be feasible. If there isn't then any party who supports a currency union would be toast and hence any perks from business will be pointless as they will be out of office. Lets be honest, the political tombstone of Nick Clegg is evidence for how things can go wrong if you break party policy and public opinion.

    Edited by Captain shortwave
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    Posted
  • Location: Stockport
  • Location: Stockport

    Regardless of how Scotland votes I'm glad I've had the privilege of discussing/reading the debate on NW. Lots of intelligent and informed people on here and I'm grateful to have had a different perspective and collection of thought and ideas than I might have otherwise had. 

     

    Keep it up! :good:

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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    When everybody was proud of being Scottish there wasJim BaxterDennis LawBobby LennoxColin SteinBilly Mc NeilJimmy JohnstoneCharlie CookeDanny Mc GraineDavid HayWillie MillerGordon StrachanGordon McQueenAlan HansenKenny DalglishArchie GemmillGraham SounessAlly McCoistNow there is a possibility of independence there is Duncan Fletcher.

    That's a very exact science you're applying there.

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    Posted
  • Location: Hayward’s Heath - home, Brighton/East Grinstead - work.
  • Weather Preferences: Snow and storms
  • Location: Hayward’s Heath - home, Brighton/East Grinstead - work.

    The currency won't go to a vote.Cameron will be bricking it from the markets.The last thing he will want is Scotland's oil tax out of BOE balance of payments.Red carpet will come to Holyrood.If they really did say no then its Sterlingisation for 5 years and then Scottish pound.Either way using Sterling is a stop gap.Max 10 years then bye bye Sterling.

    That still doesn't answer the question as to why the Yes campaign does not have a clear strategy regarding the currency that the electorate can decide upon prior to the vote. Is that because they don't know, can't decide, or even worse - any decision regarding this may make the yes vote a little more unpalatable. I certainly don't know, but would like to know this if it were critical to my country's future.

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    Posted
  • Location: Highland Scotland
  • Location: Highland Scotland

    I can't understand why such a crucial part of Independence will not be addressed until after the vote. Surely the Scottish electorate need to know this prior to making a decision?

    The possible options for currency were laid out by the fiscal commission working group. The short answer to your question though is because the UK government saw electoral advantage in the present situation.

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    Posted
  • Location: NR LOURDES SW FRANCE
  • Location: NR LOURDES SW FRANCE

    The currency won't go to a vote.Cameron will be bricking it from the markets.The last thing he will want is Scotland's oil tax out of BOE balance of payments.Red carpet will come to Holyrood.If they really did say no then its Sterlingisation for 5 years and then Scottish pound.Either way using Sterling is a stop gap.Max 10 years then bye bye Sterling.

    This is exactly why a CU probably won't happen. Currency unions survive because you can't leave them, why do you think the Eurozone hasn't fallen apart, you can't leave the Euro without basically leaving the EU.

     

    Too much is made of oil in balance of payments, its a tiny percentage offset to a degree by lower risk as the BOE won't be LOLR to Scottish banks.

     

    Cameron may have no choice but put it to a vote, as for sterlingization yes that could be temporary but really isn't suitable long term for the Scottish economy.

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    Posted
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)
  • Weather Preferences: Wind driven falling snow
  • Location: Calgary, Canada (1230m asl)

    A foolish and perhaps arrogant stance to take hey? Because if the YES vote wins and we put it to the rest of the UK whether or not Scotland should be allowed to use the pound as their currency I pretty much know what we will vote. End of ...... sterling in Scotland.

     

     

    However, I don't see that using the current British pound is critical to the yes vote, but having a manifesto that determines clearly what the alternative is and how it will work, should be.

     

    I think it's arrogant to take either view. It is arrogant for the YES side to say we'll keep using it "end of" but it's equally arrogant for the NO side or the rUK to stamp their foot and say "no you won't, end of". It's going to need some negotiation and a lot of head scratching, plus a lot of weighing up of how the debt is handled if Scotland isn't using the pound.

     

    I agree that it should have been given some thought before now. I would have been more comfortable if we'd had something along the lines of, "We'll continue to use the pound until everything has been worked out, but we will have our own currency as soon as is practicable".

    When everybody was proud of being Scottish there was

    Jim Baxter

    Dennis Law

    Bobby Lennox

    Colin Stein

    Billy Mc Neil

    Jimmy Johnstone

    Charlie Cooke

    Danny Mc Graine

    David Hay

    Willie Miller

    Gordon Strachan

    Gordon McQueen

    Alan Hansen

    Kenny Dalglish

    Archie Gemmill

    Graham Souness

    Ally McCoist

    Now there is a possibility of independence there is Duncan Fletcher.

     

    Duncan who?

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    Posted
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level

    Yes Captain but is Cameron not toast after a yes vote anyway.It might be shortermism but he will do what he`s told for the next leader so he doesnt balls up the BOE.

    Think he meant Darren Catch!Anyway Strachan is a Yes supporter glad he put him on list!

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