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Scottish Politics 2011-2017


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Posted
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level

    Foreign Giant Company in Scottish Investment shocker!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk...t-fife-16809556

    C'mon David & George, continue your investment scaremongering.

    Yeh and Wall Mart don't seem to bothered:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-16679461

    You see national and international companies work on the following principle- Is there a market in the country for our services? Will we make a profit?

    According to the Unionists company investment is done as a charity to Scotland because we are part of the UK...If we are naughty and go it alone the international and national companies wullnae like us nae mare..they only like the British apparently. You couldn't make this stuff up the sad thing is some people fall for it.

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    And that ignorant, offensive, rant sums up exactly why the YES campaign failed  

    Good god. What a load of boarish spiteful bile from bad losers has been posted during the night. I actually dread to think how Scotland would be run if this is representative of how the yes vote behav

    I'm disappointed in the lack of grace shown by some across the net in accepting this No vote. A complete lack of any empathy and understanding as to why fellow Scots didn't vote Yes.   I personally

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    Posted
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level
  • Location: Maddiston , Falkirk, Scotland 390ft above sea level

    The common denominator with all of these unionists mp's and lords is that when scotland becomes independent. All MP's and Lords representing Scottish seats will be out of a job. So when it comes to the first independent Scottish elections none of them will stand or be able stand for Scottish seats due to their antagonism and rejection of an independent Scotland. If they dare do so I hope the electorate will give them a hiding! :rofl:

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/9052367/First-SNP-peer-but-not-Sean-Connery-to-be-created-as-Government-tries-to-bring-Lords-to-heel.html

    First SNP peer to be created as Government tries to bring Lords to heel

    LOL. An SNP peer! Sorry Dave, annoying as it may be, the SNP can't be bought.

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    Posted
  • Location: New York City
  • Location: New York City

    http://newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-economy/4235-would-an-independent-scotland-be-financially-sound

    Something that grates on my nerves:

    Who are the real subsidy junkies?

    Any lingering doubt that Scotland more than pays its way, or survives on subsidies, was dispelled by a new report published in October 2007. Whilst the Daily Mail, which by no stretch of the imagination could be described as a supporter of Scottish nationalism, devoted a whole page to the analysis of the report which was based on tax paid per capita as against spending, Northern Ireland received £4,212 more than it paid in tax, North East England £3,133, Wales £2,990, N.W. England £1732, South West England £978, West Midlands £931, East Midlands £185 and lastly Scotland £38. Only the South East corner produced a small surplus due to tax paid on the high wages within the city of London at this time (pre-Credit Crunch).

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    Posted
  • Location: Coatbridge, North Lanarkshire (this lockdown) Freuchie, Fife (normally)
  • Weather Preferences: cold and snowy in winter, a good mix of weather the rest of the time
  • Location: Coatbridge, North Lanarkshire (this lockdown) Freuchie, Fife (normally)

    Ming Campbell - we vote for the guy for 6 elections entirely on the basis that he's a)the most principled politician standing http://cdn.nwstatic.co.uk/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/cool.png not a tory and c) will represent the views of his local people and not the party. And today he does this:

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmtoday/cmdebate/c_06.htm

    Just a culmination of the complete and utter moral bankrupting of a supposedly trustworthy person in a supposedly social democratic party. The only reason I have for wishing to see another UK General election is seeing the looks on those scumbags faces when the people chuck them out of office, but then I suppose a yes in the indy referendum would simply do it with a much wider reaching effect.

    Keeping up with the latest polling SS? Looks like the question itself is polling higher than whatever the pollsters were using. Or perhaps we're just gaining momentum, it certainly feels that way...

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Keeping up with the latest polling SS? Looks like the question itself is polling higher than whatever the pollsters were using. Or perhaps we're just gaining momentum, it certainly feels that way...

    Your wish is my command....

    Latest IPSOS-MORI Scottish Public Opinion Monitor out today. Summary below.

    SNP holding steady 49%

    Labour continuing to fall and now at 23%.

    Fringe parties at best scraping 13%.

    Leader of the English National Party [sic Conservatives] getting around the same level of dissatisfaction as the leader of Scottish civic National Party [sNP] is scoring for satisfaction....

    Poor Johann Lamont, more people in Scotland think Dave is doing a good job as ENP leader than she is as Scottish Labour leader.

    Conclusion: Independence supporting parties at 54% (others are Green, Margo, Socialists mainly), Labour looking in real trouble as we head towards the May local elections.

    post-9421-0-36348100-1328208646_thumb.pn

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Coatbridge, North Lanarkshire (this lockdown) Freuchie, Fife (normally)
  • Weather Preferences: cold and snowy in winter, a good mix of weather the rest of the time
  • Location: Coatbridge, North Lanarkshire (this lockdown) Freuchie, Fife (normally)

    Your wish is my command....

    Latest IPSOS-MORI Scottish Public Opinion Monitor out today. Summary below.

    SNP holding steady 49%

    Labour continuing to fall and now at 23%.

    Fringe parties at best scraping 13%.

    Leader of the English National Party [sic Conservatives) getting around the same level of dissatisfaction as the leader of Scottish civic National Party [sNP] is scoring for satisfaction....

    Poor Johann Lamont, more people in Scotland think Dave is doing a good job as ENP leader than she is as Scottish Labour leader.

    Conclusion: Independence supporting parties at 54% (others are Green, Margo, Socialists mainly), Labour looking in real trouble as we head towards the May local elections.

    Good stuff, incredibly worrying for Labour to be on 23% on a major poll in Scotland. That's less than what the tories got in 1987 in Scotland and only marginally more than what they got in '97 during the wipeout. The differences between the tory vote in '87 and the labour vote in '12: a) the tory vote in '87 was more motivated, generally speaking more affluent and therefore more likely to turn out http://cdn.nwstatic.co.uk/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/cool.png there was clear antipathy to the tories in Scotland in '87 with tactical voting against them whereas with Labour it's more like apathy. I do wonder whether an SNP majority on Glasgow council is within reach in May, that's our biggest aim. There will only be maybe two or three out of the greens, tories and lib dems in the cooncil so if the SNP is ahead of Labour in Glasgow as a whole, even if not by a huge margin, they'd be likely to take the council outright. If we can take that it would not only be a huge symbollic victory but also complete another layer of the turnover of Labour heartland to SNP territory. Note also that Glasgow tends, on opinion polls, to be in favour of independence. Interesting times indeed.
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    Posted
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL

    Johann Lamont is going to have to buck her ideas up at FMQ's. Asking a question about Fred Goodwin when Labour are up to their necks in that fiasco.

    Thought Ruth Davidson asked a great question about Scotland's future military which the FM didn't answer, he will need more detail for the referendum. Incidentally have a look and see how many Scots actually voted for Ruth in the election. Not exactly a mandate.

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    Posted
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet

    Personally i do think that Scotland should be allowed a military.

    A Falklands like agreement should suffice whereby the UK agrees to defend Scotland.

    Being realistic if any land invasion took place the UK would bomb the c*** out of the invaders whether Scotland asked for help or not so i see little point in Scotland having its own army.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Personally i do think that Scotland should be allowed a military.

    I think the rUK should be allowed an army too. Some aircraft carriers I'd permit if they are affordable. I figure the Scottish government would agree and allow that too.

    Where do you think is best for Trident if Scotland goes independent? I heard there are no plans and its all a bit embarrassing on the world stage...

    http://www.guardian....e?newsfeed=true

    Anyway, the referendum is not about deciding what kind of defense force Scotland would have, but voting to have the ability to chose chose this and what they'd get involved in overseas etc; this can't be planned ahead of the event as it will be decided by the government of a independent Scotland. That might not be the SNP. They have stated what they envisage. No other party has, which suggests a lack of forward planning.

    Scottish Tories (Ruth's Q at FMQ's) are not very bright - I mean what if we all vote yes and then vote for them in an indepenendent Scotland. Surely they need to ask themselves what kind of army they'd give us? I have requested a manifesto for an independent Scotland from them and I was told they don't have one. Worrying and might help explain why they are polling a fringe 13% in Scotland.

    ---------------------------------------------------------

    EDIT

    http://www.thescotti...ions-clash.html

    Beeb kick Salmond indy touch

    BBC bosses banned [the duly elected First Minister of Scotland] Alex Salmond from its panel at Scotland's Six Nations clash with England today — despite him vowing NOT to mention independence, it emerged last night.

    UK = http://en.wikipedia....Banana_republic

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL
  • Location: Carryduff, County Down 420ft ASL

    That is shocking. Almost as bad as the BBC's introduction to the game going on about Bannockburn and Culloden etc... I mean what the f^^^.

    Apparantly England beat Scotland at Culloden despite the fact their were very few English actually involved.

    Unbelievable.

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    Posted
  • Location: Camborne
  • Location: Camborne

    Where do you think is best for Trident if Scotland goes independent? I heard there are no plans and its all a bit embarrassing on the world stage...

    Not a problem. Transfer from the Holy Loch to Plymouth. Thank the lord it's in England and not Cornwall.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Another poll out today has the SNP on 50%. Also asking indy Q's.

    http://www.snp.org/m...endence-and-snp

    http://www.huffingto..._n_1255544.html

    The poll puts SNP support at 50 per cent in the constituency vote for the Scottish Parliament, compared to 29 per cent for Labour, and 14 per cent for the Tories. Compared to last year’s election, SNP support is up 5 points, and Labour are down 3 points. SNP seats at Holyrood would increase from 69 to 71, while the Lib Dems would slump from 5 to 3.

    So in good agreement with the IPSOS MORI which had the SNP on 49%.

    As for independence, neck and neck within error again but a YES vote favoured (no must be consistently greater than 50% for that to be the more probable result as unsures invariably vote YES in majority):

    Y = 37%

    N = 42%

    Interested but insure = 21%

    When all options are put before people, independence has plurality:

    Independence: 37%

    Status quo: 33%

    Devo-max: 30%

    So again we have something close to 7 in 10 wanting min devo maxx.

    You can see why the unionist parties want the referendum asap; it is the only chance they have of scraping a no vote.

    --------------------

    EDIT, also, Westminster sticking its oar in in recent weeks has had the desired effect. SNP membership up 9% in just three weeks. ~1 new member every 15 mins compared to 10 per day before Dave tried to be 'decisive'. Thanks very much Dave; keep up the good work!

    --------------------

    EDIT 2. Oh, and thanks to the BBC for being a good state broadcaster/propagandist tool. All over the papers - cool!

    Posted Image

    http://theherald.newspaperdirect.com/epaper/viewer.aspx

    They'd give Iranian state TV a run for their money.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: NH7256
  • Weather Preferences: where's my vote?
  • Location: NH7256

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/interactive/2012/feb/05/what-being-british-mean-interactive

    Makes interesting reading by raising many points from lots of ordinary people across England, Ireland, Wales & Scotland. It's almost as interesting to see how views vary with age.

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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    I'm a man in my early twenties and I've noticed my generation are really falling out over the whole thing, but not in an aggressive way. The constitutional question keeps coming up in conversation, it surrounds us in a way that it has never surrounded the 'next' generation. Thing is, we have absolutely everything to win or lose when it comes to this - the referendum will be held immediately after I graduate, so it will absolutely define my adult life. The same applies for each and every one of my friends; it will be when we're trying to get proper settled jobs, trying to buy houses, beginning to look to settle down. I don't fear change, I whole heartedly embrace the future, but that doesn't mean I don't worry.

    This is why I think my generation will suddenly leap from apathy.

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    I'm a man in my early twenties and I've noticed my generation are really falling out over the whole thing, but not in an aggressive way. The constitutional question keeps coming up in conversation, it surrounds us in a way that it has never surrounded the 'next' generation. Thing is, we have absolutely everything to win or lose when it comes to this - the referendum will be held immediately after I graduate, so it will absolutely define my adult life. The same applies for each and every one of my friends; it will be when we're trying to get proper settled jobs, trying to buy houses, beginning to look to settle down. I don't fear change, I whole heartedly embrace the future, but that doesn't mean I don't worry.

    This is why I think my generation will suddenly leap from apathy.

    You sound a bit like me in 1997; I was in my 2nd last year of uni having been old enough to remember a good bit of the thatcher years. The disaster she made as a UK PM affected me very directly; my father - in 1979 a civil engineer - went from building roads and bridges (inc a fair bit of the A9, e.g. the Findhorn viaduct) to having to leave our home in the Highlands and move to near Edinburgh to sell cash registers initially. Both my parents voted YES in 1979 and to this day will never ever trust a London government due to the latter rigging the 1979 referendum. They remember the betrayal all too well.

    I went to St. Andrews and was in Skye on a geology field trip when the results of the devolution referendum (to which I voted Yes + Yes, 1997 being my first year of voting) came out. Being St. Andrews students, I was like one of 5 Scots out of 30 of us but those from south of the border were so pleased for us and we had a big party on the beach. Was a very exciting time.

    I was a young man of the devolution generation; lets hope your generation are the independence generation.

    EDIT. I remember all the same scare stories about devolution - not much different to now. Devolution would be a disaster, businesses would move away, the Scots economy would collapse. Instead, it was a great move and set us on the 'motorway to independence with no exits' as it was famously described by some unionists. How correct the were.

    --------------------------------------------------------

    EDIT.

    I loved this mail headline.

    It seems there is no positive case for the Union, so the best unionists can come up with is:

    FEAR

    Interestingly, this 'memo story' is really funny…

    Fantasy: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2096650/Hadrians-Wall-customs-Scotland-goes-stop-illegal-migrants-flooding-England.html

    Reality: http://newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-opinion/4280-panicking-westminster-makes-contradictory-and-ridiculous-threats-to-scare-scots-into-line

    Ok vetoing is no longer possible re a new country joining the EU, but if the UK was the successor state and Scotland a ‘new country’ with the former keeping its status with the EU and Scotland having to re-negotiate, then….

    Scotland would be a ‘colony’ under international law and would leave the UK with no debt. Cool. Loads of oil, natural resources etc and no debt!

    Ye canny have it both ways; either Scotland is a full partner in the UK with all the same rights as the rest of the UK, takes a per capita share of the army/overseas assets, etc + a share of debt, has as much right to the £/say in BoE or it’s a colony and walks away with no extra-territorial assets but no debt either.

    Of course the headline also obviously begs the question – if such things are on Dave’s mind – why on earth would you want to be ruled by such a petty little government? My 4 year old has more mature attitudes. “It’s ma baw and am no playin anymore†springs to mind.

    post-9421-0-86964000-1328560737_thumb.jp

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    This has just popped up on the radar.

    http://www.scottisht...ence_referendum

    Europe asked to monitor Scottish independence referendum

    Europe has been asked by the Scottish Democratic Alliance (SDA) to monitor Scotland’s independence referendum due to fears that it will be manipulated by Westminster, Scottish Times can exclusively reveal.

    Steered by Chairman Dr James Wilkie - a retired diplomat and currently a consultant to the United Nations - the SDA has sent letters with a joint Memorandum, sounding the alarm, to the Council of Europe (CoE) and the Organisation for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) warning of the potential for the UK Government to politically interfere in Scotland's referendum and for its failure to observe international law by asserting that only it has the legal competence to legislate for the plebiscite.

    Interesting development. I wondered how soon it was before such things were needed; the whole 'Westminster needs to give permission or the referdendum is illegal' issue seen in recent weeks is obviously against international law.

    EDIT. There have also been rumours about the BBC getting in trouble for its unionist (Labour mainly) bias. Europe has strict rules for state broadcasters to ensure they aren't like Iranian state TV.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet
  • Location: Leeds/Bradford border, 185 metres above sea level, around 600 feet

    SS as i recall the SNP can hold whatever referendum they like, when they like. The only thing is that it is not legally binding unless Westminster agrees.

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    Posted
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl
  • Weather Preferences: Freezing fog, frost, snow, sunshine.
  • Location: Inbhir Nis / Inverness - 636 ft asl

    SS as i recall the SNP can hold whatever referendum they like, when they like. The only thing is that it is not legally binding unless Westminster agrees.

    Which they will, let's be realistic. One certain way to damage the case for a continued union would be to prevent the referendum, which the majority of Scots want to be held regardless of their political leanings.

    I wonder what the effect of the Sewell Convention would be on a Wesminster-led referendum?

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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    The only thing is that it is not legally binding unless Westminster agrees.

    Which is the point - this is against international law. While it is peeing them off it seems, Westminster is irrelevant in terms of the referendum. As long as it is judged free and fair by the international community, it is up to the latter to welcome Scotland into the world if a yes vote is delivered.

    And yes, as Rab says, while the whole 'legality' issue has been jumped on by unionists (mainly Scots unionist politicians facing an end to the gravy train I might add!) as a way to try and take control somehow, they are having to concede that now with no strings even though it is irrelvant in the face of a yes vote anyway.

    http://www.scotsman....alone_1_2047506

    Anyhoo, the electoral reform society have agreed with international law experts now:

    http://www.heraldsco...ndum.1328670362

    Support for Holyrood to call shots on referendum

    THE Scottish Government has received another boost to its referendum proposals, with the Electoral Reform Society adding its voice to calls for a "no strings" deal.

    The group, which describes itself as "an independent campaigning organisation to champion the rights of voters and improve UK democracy", researched the legislative issues and interviewed experts before coming to the conclusion that the First Minister has the right to call the shots.

    It follows an article in The Herald yesterday from constitutional expert Dr Matt Qvortrup.

    He stated that the Westminster Government should back off from threatening legal action by the UK Supreme Court.

    Dr Qvortrup noted: "Generally speaking, independence is not an issue in which the 'mother country' has a direct say. A country becomes independent when it is recognised by the international community."

    As we all know, the UK is one of the most centralised governments in the western world (many municipal authorities in European countries have more power than the Scottish parliament). You have PMs dictating how often nurses walk around wards FGS. Westminster likes to have as much power as possible and giving any away is an anathema to it. The concept that Scotland is fully in control of its own destiny is hard to take for some down there. At the moment, you have unelected convicted criminals attempting to pass laws to control Scotland - these people don't want an end to the trough for obvious reasons.

    http://newsnetscotla...-to-lose-titles

    --------------------------------------

    EDIT. Oh cool,and 'Big man' will not be charged. Well done the Scottish Crown Office!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-16954147

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    http://local.stv.tv/glasgow/news/local-democracy/27750-bombshell-for-labour-as-councillor-resigns-on-eve-of-budget/

    Bombshell for Labour as councillor resigns on eve of budget

    That's 1 defection (to the SNP) and 2 resignations in as many weeks. Glasgow Labour tearing itself apart as the May elections approach.

    If you want to see the depths Scottish Labour have fallen too, have a wee look at the guff they publish on http://www.labourhame.com/

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    Posted
  • Location: Coatbridge, North Lanarkshire (this lockdown) Freuchie, Fife (normally)
  • Weather Preferences: cold and snowy in winter, a good mix of weather the rest of the time
  • Location: Coatbridge, North Lanarkshire (this lockdown) Freuchie, Fife (normally)

    http://local.stv.tv/...-eve-of-budget/

    Bombshell for Labour as councillor resigns on eve of budget

    That's 1 defection (to the SNP) and 2 resignations in as many weeks. Glasgow Labour tearing itself apart as the May elections approach.

    If you want to see the depths Scottish Labour have fallen too, have a wee look at the guff they publish on http://www.labourhame.com/

    They survived the budget vote 40-38 -roll on May!
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    Posted
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    They survived the budget vote 40-38 -roll on May!

    Aye, humiliation for Labour today as 6 Councillors rebelled; that in addition to various resignations and defections country-wide recently.

    http://news.stv.tv/s...fter-rebellion/

    Nice people the Labour party:

    Southside Central Councillor Anne Marie Millar claimed a colleague threatened her son's apprenticeship if she didn't vote with the Labour party.

    Speaking to STV, she said: "A colleague spoke to me and said he sat on the board of City Building and asked if my son had an apprenticeship there.

    "I asked him if he was threatening my son's apprenticeship. He can have all the goes at me that he likes but don't bring my son into it."

    All those people watching this on the Telly....

    Of course what has happened is after May last year lots of Labour MSP lost their seats. To make room for the party favourites, Labour London and Glasgow HQ have been overruling local Labour ward parties and deselecting their candidates in the hope that 'Jobs for the Boys' might survive for those who kiss the right butts etc. Today was the result - Labour fighting Labour with constant updates on the TV, radio etc.

    The last unionist party with any sway is dying in Scotland; in the May council elections they are likely to be reduced to not much more than the fringe libs and Tories. Here's hoping!

    I shall be voting SNP, Green and another independence party depending on who is standing come May (Standard transferable vote).

    Who will be the parties come independence? My Guess:

    Right of Centre = Scottish Democratic Alliance (currently not putting forward candidates but will soon)

    Centre to slightly left = SNP / 'Scottish Social Democrats'

    Green left = Greens

    Left = Scottish Socialists

    The Liberals might survive, but the SNP have taken Labour's old ground and the Conservative and Unionists will die with the death of the Union.

    All going to plan.

    ----------------------------

    EDIT.

    http://news.stv.tv/p..._medium=twitter

    Call for openness in independence debate

    Green leader Patrick Harvie said some MSPs are "more open to independence than their parties will admit".

    .... Before the meeting he said: "Over the years I've met members of all parties who are more open to independence than their parties will admit, and it's not hard to find some who are privately enthusiastic. It's important for our democracy that they should feel free to speak their minds, and to campaign for a Yes vote without fear of party discipline"

    Aye, hidden within the Unionist parties are independence supporters. When they are sure the wind is blowing that way, they'll come out of the closet.

    Edited by scottish skier
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    Posted
  • Location: Darlington
  • Weather Preferences: heavy convective snow showers, blizzards, 30C sunshine
  • Location: Darlington

    Scottish skier, i have a few questions for you.

    If scotland leaves the union what will happen to the scottish soldiers in the british army? Dont for one minute say that all the scottish regiments will simply become part of a new scottish army. There is no way that scotland could afford to pay for all the scots servicemen currently in the british army there would have to be redundancies aplenty

    Also what about scottish defence industry arent the two carriers largely being built in glasgow? That work would instantly stop, as the RN wouldnt allow its most powerful ships to be built by a foreign power. What about the scottish bases RAF, army and navy. All the thousands of people employed there would go as well. Scotland simply couldnt afford to maintain its current defence infrastructure if it was paying for it all itself. One more military question what about the training and logistics for example officers for your new army dont just grow on trees you couldnt have sandhurst anymore you would have to set up a totally new training school for soldiers and officers, a massively expensive proposition. Salmond says scotland will have one naval base air base etc. Do you know how much a Typhoon costs try about 100million a plane how much does a challenger tank cost. Oh yes who is going to maintain all these vehicles where would you get spare parts from? All very expensive i think. At this rate the scottish taxpayer will be paying 95% tax.

    Also another question what about national debt if you want 10 percent of British military resources you can have 10 percent of British debt as well.

    What about the scottish banks RBS for one was saved by british tax payers money not that im bothered because as it stands RBS is a british bank and deserves as much a bailout as any other but if you leave the union that would be the sole responsibility of the scottish tax payer.

    Also the question of europe if you are independent you would be a new nation just like anyother and would presumably have to join the european union which would be a lengthy process perhaps even years, you would lose all the preferential trade agreements with europe and the rest of UK you would essentially be like serbia or belaruss now. Not to mention the hundreds of thousands of scots who work in england those people would instantly become illegal immigrants in england and not being european citizens would not be allowed free movement within europe, what happens then? What about inward investment who is going to want to invest in scotland when its very future in the uk and europe is unknown?

    What about all this free education and everything else England dosent get it all needs to be payed for. Dont forget you have to also pay for your new military infrastructure and everything i mentioned, all very expensive.

    What about the BBC and such obviously scotland would have to set up and pay for its own national TV as BBC would no longer broadcast in scotland, oh yes more job losses i think.

    Your plan to end the most successful union in history would cause suffering and unemployment on both sides of the border and scotland would lose hundreds of thousands of jobs.

    One last thing I bloody love edinburgh best city in UK i dont want to take my passport every time i go to visit.

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  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl
  • Location: Near Lauder, SE Scotland, 175 m asl

    Scottish skier, i have a few questions for you.

    Please go back to the beginning of the thread and read it through fully. You will find answers to all your questions; most of these topics (e.g. Halifax BOS and RBS National Westminster banks, which are mostly based in England/internationally with only small (5%) Scots assets and paid huge amounts of corporation tax to the London Treasury etc, EU laws regarding procurement of defense equipment which means it would be illegal to exclude Scotland, UK and Scotland having equal EU successor state status otherwise Scotland would be considered a 'colony' so national debt free....) have been discussed at length.

    Also, you might wish to have a look at other modern western European nations of comparable population size to Scotland to get an idea of defense forces etc. Pay particular attention to those with huge oil, gas and renewable energy resources.

    Passport to visit Edinburgh? LOL - that put a smile on my face. Don't worry - that's not going to happen unless the RUK goes in a hissy fit.

    All the UK parties have stated at various times that Scotland is perfectly viable as an independent nation because, well, of course it's perfectly true. Scotland is quite a nice we earne running at a modest profit most years, hence the reluctance of Westminster to see us go.

    Here's Dave saying we could go it alone - although he seems to struggle with some questions on Scotland; notably how many Tory MEPs we have... http://cdn.nwstatic.co.uk/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.png

    http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkaMx84GGUs

    Successful union? Some might question that give how far the UK is down the GDP per capita, Human Development Index and GINI tables etc, but just think how much more successful we can be working together as equal partners - a bigger combined voice at the EU, UN etc due to a greater number of total seats is just for starters. Scotland would not actually be going anywhere and the view from your window would not change!

    Cheers,

    SS

    Edited by scottish skier
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