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Scottish Politics 2011-2017


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And that ignorant, offensive, rant sums up exactly why the YES campaign failed  

Good god. What a load of boarish spiteful bile from bad losers has been posted during the night. I actually dread to think how Scotland would be run if this is representative of how the yes vote behav

I'm disappointed in the lack of grace shown by some across the net in accepting this No vote. A complete lack of any empathy and understanding as to why fellow Scots didn't vote Yes.   I personally

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4 hours ago, Northernlights said:

Get into a whole new layer of politics there as probably the majority of these farms  with turbines are owner occupied. If you are a  farm  tenant your landlord will be looking for a share making it not so financially attractive.

Another point is 50 and 60 km/hour gearboxes now are much more in demand in large tractors so they can cover the vast distances between all the farms they operate on. In fact modern tractors spend more time on the road than they do in the field witness   a  local large scale dairy farm where the constant emptying of the slurry pit involves hundreds of miles of travel on side and main roads which have never been built for such heavy loads and are now breaking up.

Methane powered tractors then?

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2 hours ago, Dougal said:

Methane powered tractors then?

Spot on there are rumours of a bio digester being installed to handle all the slurry and markedly reduce the road trips.

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With the UK still having zero plan for its 'independence' [aka brexit], it's good to know Scotland does have plans.

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-44188668

Sturgeon: Growth commission will 'restart' independence debate

Nicola Sturgeon will "restart the debate" on Scottish independence this week as her party's economic growth commission report is published.

...Ms Sturgeon was pressed on the timing of a second independence referendum on ITV's Peston on Sunday.

She said: "Once we get some clarity, which hopefully we will in the autumn of this year, about the Brexit outcome and the future relationship between the UK and the EU then I will consider again this question of the timing of an independence referendum.

"I'm not going to say more about that in advance of that moment arising.

"But of course over the next couple of weeks we will, I suppose, restart a debate about why independence for Scotland is an opportunity and what those opportunities are.

"As you know we've had a growth commission looking at the economic opportunities of independence.

"Its report will be published in the coming days and I think that's quite an important moment, because if you think about the last couple of years in the UK it has been very much a debate about how we cope with the damage of Brexit.

"What I think Scotland now has the opportunity to do is look at how we seize the opportunities that lie ahead, so a debate based very much on ambition and hope not a debate that's based on despair, which is how the Brexit debate so often feels."

It's great that we are kicking off this campaign with baseline Yes 'tomorrow morning' at 46% and independence the medium to long term constitutional preference of the majority now according to polls.

I think the main job is to convince the 7%+ or so that want indy but are cautious on going for it right now that it's time to just get on with it. The brexit mess is not going to get any better, but likely a whole lot worse.

I suspect however that the English Tories taking control of Holyrood powers will probably be sufficient in itself though.

EDIT

If we take the 46% value (average of most recent 'tomorrow' polls), that's just 3.4/100 Scots that need to move to indy and majority beckons (assuming an 85% turnout). Doable.

Edited by scottish skier
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Poll data being reported by the Daily Mail.

Not sure of precise origins.

Scots feel as a people they are identifying more with Scotland than with the UK compared to 5+ years ago.

Personal support for the union has also fallen net 'in the past few years'.

identifypoll.jpg

supportUK.jpg

WoS had been tweeting snippets.

https://twitter.com/WingsScotland

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This was on the BBC right?

Quote

Here's the full report from the pro-Labour think tank.

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https://fraserofallander.org/scottish-economy/gross-national-income-statistics-for-scotland-a-net-outflow-of-scottish-income/

Gross national income statistics for Scotland: a net outflow of Scottish income?

Fraser of Allander Institute - May 7, 2018

Last week, the Scottish Government published experimental statistics on Scottish Gross National Income (GNI).

This is the latest in the round of developments to widen the coverage of economic statistics in Scotland. The commitment of the Scottish Government to improving the databank of Scottish economic statistics is to be commended. In recent years, this has seen the development of national accounts, a significant improvement in the coverage of GERS, a bringing forward of the publication of GDP and new statistics on Scottish productivity.

Last week’s figures show that Scottish GNI was estimated to be around £27,900 per head in 2016.

Perhaps of greatest interest, the figures also show that Scottish GNI was estimated to equal 94% of Scottish GDP. In other words, there was a net outflow of income from Scotland to the rest of the UK and/or overseas...

...As highlighted above, the fact that GNI is lower than GDP suggests that that the amount of national income being retained for the benefit of the people of Scotland is lower than the value of what is being actually produced here.

Shockeroonie.

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1 hour ago, scottish skier said:

This was on the BBC right?

Here's the full report from the pro-Labour think tank.

Shockeroonie.

Aye, hold the front page.

As a net exporter of oil, whisky, food and drink it is no shock that the shareholders of big business and the London offices of big business are impoverishing the average Scot.

 

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Democracy is rule by consent. Without consent, it is not democracy. 

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http://www.holyrood.com/articles/inside-politics/scottish-devolution-consent-everything

Scottish devolution: consent is everything

Holyrood refuses consent, Westminster ponders ignoring it - is Donald Dewar’s legacy at stake as parliaments clash over Brexit?

The Scottish Parliament has refused its consent to a major piece of UK legislation, by 93 votes to 30.

The SNP were joined by Scottish Labour, the Liberal Democrats and the Greens in their rejection of the UK Government’s latest compromise over the repatriation on normally devolved areas from Brussels.

This left the UK Government with a tricky choice: amend the EU Withdrawal Bill or press on with it without the consent of Holyrood.

If it chooses the former, then it faces further divisions within the Conservative Party and it will have implications for Wales, which has already given consent to the offer as it stands.

If it chooses the latter, we are in uncharted territory as it will be the first time the will of the Scottish Parliament has been ignored by the British government.

Legally, Westminster can overrule Holyrood. But it has never had the political courage to do so before.

The situation is not entirely without precedent. A number of consent motions have gone through Holyrood and not all of them gave consent.

For example, in 2011 the Scottish Parliament used a legislative consent motion to influence welfare reform where responsibilities could be considered devolved competence.

That time, however, like all LCMs before it, amendments were subsequently made to the legislation by UK ministers. 

This time, the Conservatives are isolated in both parliaments as other parties backed the Scottish Government’s position...

...“The SNP has to wait and see what happens with Brexit,” she told Bloomberg. “If the constitutional issue becomes about devolution and not about independence, then that helps them and not the Conservatives. It becomes about self-governance.”

The game has to play some legal rounds first. 

Even if the UK Government does decide to ignore the will of the Scottish Parliament, whether the UK Government’s EU Withdrawal Bill or Scotland’s emergency ‘continuity bill’ becomes law hinges on a legal challenge to the latter being heard at the Supreme Court in July.

Designed to pre-empt exactly this scenario, Holyrood’s presiding officer Ken Macintosh warned the legislation falls outwith the Scottish Parliament’s remit, but Lord Advocate James Wolffe said it had been “carefully framed” to be in line with both UK and EU law.

If politicians cannot provide clarity before then, the constitution is in the hands of a judge.

 

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An option I suppose. But England keeps trashing the £ so I'm not sure it's a good one.

Best get out as soon as possible; Scots £ would do well enough, particularly as a petrocurrency.

Quote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-44210753

Mark Carney says currency union 'economically possible'

The Bank of England governor has said it would be economically possible for an independent Scotland to have a currency union with the rest of the UK.

But Mark Carney said it would be for others to decide whether it was politically desirable.

He was speaking to the treasury committee ahead of the publication of the SNP's growth commission report.

It has been looking at economic policy options for an independent Scotland - including what currency it could use.

Obviously to share sterling debt there would need to be full access to sterling printing facilities (to print the sterling to pay the debt) so any refusal from the rUK of some form of currency union means a debt free Scotland. 

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33 minutes ago, scottish skier said:

An option I suppose. But England keeps trashing the £ so I'm not sure it's a good one.

Best get out as soon as possible; Scots £ would do well enough, particularly as a petrocurrency.

Obviously to share sterling debt there would need to be full access to sterling printing facilities (to print the sterling to pay the debt) so any refusal from the rUK of some form of currency union means a debt free Scotland. 

As a short term option sharing Sterling makes sense until such time as a Scottish Central Bank is set up and there is an agreed share of assets/liabilities between Scotland the RuK.

The Irish Free State had the Irish Punt which was pegged to the UK pound until it went it's own way and then of course became the Euro.

The Yoons won't be happy with this pronouncement though.

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Not quite sure why we can't set up our own Central Bank now.(in all but name possibly)

Who's to say we can't? Or will the Scottish Investment bank simply morph into a Central Bank? Are we hidebound by that little reserved matter, Trade and Industry because, other than that, I don't see any legitimate reason why not.

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Was too late to edit above post:

Seems it's reserved under the remit of the Treasury. Will just have to collect more limpet shells!

(I do use them, they make good small crucibles for smelting silver and gold, other sea shells tend to explode, fun if you like dodging red hot shrapnel!)

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Independence would have supposedly hit us by £500 by comparison; if Better Together were to be believed.

Quote

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/22/brexit-vote-cost-uk-mark-carney-bank-of-england?CMP=share_btn_tw

Brexit vote has cost each UK household £900, says Mark Carney

Bank of England governor’s comments risk renewed confrontation with Brexiters

British households are more than £900 worse off after the vote to leave the EU, according to the governor of the Bank of England, in comments that risk a renewed confrontation with senior Brexit supporters in the government.

Comparing the current state of household finances with forecasts made by the Bank before the referendum, prepared on the basis of a remain vote, Mark Carney told MPs that household incomes were now significantly lower than expected.

“Real household incomes are about £900 per household lower than we forecast in May of 2016, which is a lot of money,” he said, referring to the total lost growth for incomes in the two years since the 2016 referendum.

 

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More cash to help pay for England's brexit.

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-44224377

Regulator hails success of oil and gas licensing round

UK regulators have declared that oil and gas exploration is "very much alive" after awarding 123 offshore licences in the UK Continental Shelf.

The Oil and Gas Authority (OGA) said 61 companies had been offered licences over 229 blocks or part-blocks in the 30th Offshore Licensing Round.

Fourteen of the licences will move straight to field development planning.

New commitments also include eight exploration or appraisal wells and nine new 3D seismic surveys.

 

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43 minutes ago, scottish skier said:

More cash to help pay for England's brexit.

 

Yet, this Union fud seems to think a Scottish Central Bank will have no assets to prop up a new Scottish Currency!!! £300 Billion! Who believes that?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/05/23/nicola-sturgeon-warned-new-scottish-currency-would-cost-300/

 

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One of the arguments of the Yoon message is that it would be ridiculous for Scotland to leave the Uk's "Single Market" where 4 times as many Scottish exports go to than the EU.

This ridiculous argument seems to imply of course that the RuK would impose tariff's on Scotland as a result. Or is it ridiculous?

Well, it appears not...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-44210833

The UK abandoned New Zealand leaving it to fend for itself in 1973, and what would know, despite some early heartache, New Zealand is doing rather well.

Hopefully, come the 2nd Iref, we can use New Zealand as an example of how Scotland can still survive, even if the RuK wants to play silly beggers.

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On 24/05/2018 at 13:08, mountain shadow said:

One of the arguments of the Yoon message is that it would be ridiculous for Scotland to leave the Uk's "Single Market" where 4 times as many Scottish exports go to than the EU.

This ridiculous argument seems to imply of course that the RuK would impose tariff's on Scotland as a result. Or is it ridiculous?

Well, it appears not...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-44210833

The UK abandoned New Zealand leaving it to fend for itself in 1973, and what would know, despite some early heartache, New Zealand is doing rather well.

Hopefully, come the 2nd Iref, we can use New Zealand as an example of how Scotland can still survive, even if the RuK wants to play silly beggers.

rUK going for a hard brexit with no EU/EEA trade deal (which would cover an iScotland)?

We'd definitely need to bail in that case.

Anyway, what's rarely mentioned is the much of our 'trade' is supplying their oil and gas (and power). I suppose we can just sell that direct to Europe and they can rely on Putin for strategic reserves. 

--

Also, this is only slightly more expensive than our official share of the £4 billion renovations of England's palatial parliament.

 

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Another Scot the English Tories are trying to deport.

This example pretty much sums up the brexit Britain 'hostile environment' towards non-brits (Mrs SS and family included).

Quote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-44271369

Glasgow 2014 baton holder faces deportation

A student nurse who served in the Scottish Youth Parliament and carried the Queen's Commonwealth Games baton is facing deportation.

Denzel Darku, 23, moved to the UK from Ghana nine years ago but is fighting to stay in Scotland having seen two appeals rejected.

The former Paisley Grammar School pupil said: "It has been upsetting because I have nothing in Ghana."

On the UK thread I was being told by brexiters that we Scots don't understand proper immigration because our immigrants and mainly are nice white English people, so not immigrants (even though they're of a different nationality / from a different county and have come here for economic reasons).

Well, how can we ever possibly have other types of immigrants if the English Tories keep deporting these?

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English Tories seem to be really going for it at the minute in terms of rounding up people in Scotland and deporting them.

You have to be seriously xenophobic / racist to deport people who aren't even in your country, just in a nearby one. 

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UK government = zero plan

Scottish government = big plans

Quote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-44278439

Sturgeon takes Brexit concerns to Brussels

_101778119_hi047087156.jpg

Nicola Sturgeon is to raise Scottish concerns over Brexit in a meeting with chief EU negotiator Michel Barnier in Brussels.

Scotland's first minister has called on the UK government to offer more clarity on its plans for the future relationship with the EU.

And she has demanded that it "engage properly" with devolved governments across the UK.

The UK government has declined to comment...

....Ms Sturgeon is to hold the meeting while in Brussels for the official opening of the expanded Scotland House, a hub for Scottish businesses in Europe.

 

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Whatever side of the abortion debate people sit on, the N. Ireland issue is revealing the utterly stinking hypocrisy of the UK when it comes to devolution.

We are now seeing that things are simply reserved or devolved when it suits. 

England to N. Ireland: "We'll take control of your fisheries so we can line our pockets from them, but we'll generously give you your home rule by devolving hot potatoes such as abortion."

 

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The Evolution of Society

1)     Small tribal units of nomadic hunter gatherers – circa 10,000 BC

2)     Settled farming existence developing city states – circa 8,000 BC

3)     City states combining to form small countries – circa 460 AD

4)     Some to combine via conquest into Empires, which grew and eventually fell – circa 2,000 BC to 20th century.

5)     Small countries combining to make larger countries circa 800 AD to 19th century.

6)     Countries combining to make continental blocs, mainly 19th and 20th century.

Yes, tribal units of hunter gatherers still exist, city states still exist and small countries still exist but probably about half of the Earth’s population now live in continental blocs, each which consist of several states with varying degrees of autonomy.

Some were formed by conquest and others by settlement.

Along the way, some blocs sub divided into smaller units but these are still relatively large in their own right – e.g. Indian sub-continent.

In the second half of the 20th century, there was a first, as far as I am aware and that was by a group of countries, volunteering to yield a small part of their sovereignty to form a bloc which worked in freedom and democracy for the common good of all.

That was the European Union, which until then, the continent of Europe had been punctuated by a series of fairly frequent wars based on nationalist self-interest.

Since then there have been none within the borders of the EU, whilst if we look at the rest of the world, particularly the Middle east, wars, caused through nationalistic and religious ideals still punctuate the everyday life of the people living there.

Progress moves in fits and starts but generally speaking its overall direction is forward.

Prolonged periods of peace have not been the natural state of man’s history but it is a precious commodity to be guarded.

Our aim should be to extend on what we have already achieved and with hard work, understanding and respect of others, we may extend that further with time.

The big danger is that with an ever-increasing global population and increasing desertification, pressures for instability will increase. It is therefore necessary that the democratic free blocs remain true to their principles and act as a beacon for the remainder of the world in order to encourage co-operation. 

It can be done but it requires this active co-operation, a broad perspective, universal respect and will of all to achieve it, otherwise we could end up with a regression back to the dark ages.

We all have a responsibility towards the preservation of our planet and its peoples for subsequent generations.

I think it is something worth thinking about, don’t you?

    

 

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