The Middle East...where Are Events Taking Us?

[PersianPaladin 426]

I wasn't so much thinking about us ....rather Turkey http://www.eurasiare...one-over-syria/

Shi..

[The PIT 9,193]

I wasn't so much thinking about us ....rather Turkey http://www.eurasiare...one-over-syria/

Here we go again. Another war for supercameron to get involved with and get more brownie points than Blair.

Going to be rather ironic though as the west weakens further the Arab world seems to be falling into civil war.

[Snowyowl9 1,869]

A journalist saying whats been going on in Syria from RT.

http://rt.com/news/syria-terrorism-cia-destabilization-863/

[knocker 57,702]

Yere right.

"He added that Syrian society is the most tolerant society in the Middle East, the one place where all kinds of people live together in remarkable harmony, Muslims and Christians of all kinds".

I'm not sure the people of Lebanon would agree with that. And let's not forget The Hama massacre that occurred in February 1982.

[Village 170]

I think you are all missing the point. Its not about Syria.

Its a smoke screen, but the authorities understand on both sides what the build up is all about. Its Iran.

[knocker 57,702]

I think you are all missing the point. Its not about Syria.

Its a smoke screen, but the authorities understand on both sides what the build up is all about. Its Iran.

What build up?

[Aaron 919]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15908525

Iran votes to downgrade relations with us.. and even wishes us death.. how charming

[knocker 57,702]

Getting your retaliation in first.

Saudi Arabia: Protesters and reformists targeted in name of security

The last nine months has seen a new wave of repression in Saudi Arabia as authorities have cracked down on protesters and reformists on security grounds, Amnesty International said today.

In Saudi Arabia: Repression in the Name of Security, the organization says hundreds of people have been arrested for demonstrating, while the government has drafted an anti-terror law that would effectively criminalize dissent as a "terrorist crime†and further strip away rights from those accused of such offences.

http://www.amnesty.org/en/news/saudi-arabia-protesters-and-reformists-targeted-name-security-2011-12-01

[Village 170]

What build up?

Forces, in terms of US and Russia....watch the space....the US are making a clever move with airspace support for Turkey over Syria and that is being watched with reflection to the IRAN situation and Israel. Dont forget that the Russians and the Chinese have the defence and oil contracts in Iran. The Russians have moved some of their warships into the region. Edited December 1, 2011 by Village

[Kiwi 1,397]

The Outcome of the Egyptian Elections;

I see that the Muslim Brotherhood aka freedom and justice party are set to be the biggest party (40%?) and together with other Islamic parties, including the scarily ultra conservative Nour party (30%?) they will hold a large majority in parliament.

Thats the trouble with democracy....the "right" people don't always win!!

Perhaps we should invite them to join the EU ....then we could just get them to vote again and again until they get it right. On the other hand the egyptian military might simply deal with the problem of democracy themselves.

Forces, in terms of US and Russia....watch the space....the US are making a clever move with airspace support for Turkey over Syria and that is being watched with reflection to the IRAN situation and Israel. Dont forget that the Russians and the Chinese have the oil contracts in Iran. The Russians have moved some of their warships into the region.

Oh good!! ....just a thought? ...am I right in thinking that WWII lifted the world out of the great depression of the 1930s?

Edited December 1, 2011 by Kiwi

[Village 170]

Thats what they say and its why I proclaimed in the thread about the Euro.....queue a world war! If it doesnt start again in europe it looks most likely to occur soon in the middle east.

[Guest]

The Outcome of the Egyptian Elections;

I see that the Muslim Brotherhood aka freedom and justice party are set to be the biggest party (40%?) and together with other Islamic parties, including the scarily ultra conservative Nour party (30%?) they will hold a large majority in parliament.

Thats the trouble with democracy....the "right" people don't always win!!

Perhaps we should invite them to join the EU ....then we could just get them to vote again and again until they get it right. On the other hand the egyptian military might simply deal with the problem of democracy themselves.

I remember my old Geography teacher telling us over half a century ago that democracy always has within itself the seeds to destroy itself.

A frightening thought but it is true.

Edited December 1, 2011 by mike Meehan

[knocker 57,702]

I remember my old Geography teacher telling us over half a century ago that democracy always has within itself the seeds to destroy itself.

A frightening thought but it is true.

Or a perfect democracy is the most shameless thing in the world.

The Muslim Brotherhood stands for the rule of a particular type of law, namely Sharia and Quranic punishments. This is far from the traditions of personal conscience, private judgment and the separation of civic and religious authority on which Western democracies rely. So where, I wonder do we go from here, and what affect will it have on the relations with Israel? Nothing good I shouldn't imagine.

[Wales123098 157]

Reteurs reporting that Iran has shot down a US military aircraft..... Oh dear

Edited December 4, 2011 by Wales123098

[Village 170]

Not surprising really.

[knocker 57,702]

Iran's military has shot down a US reconnaissance drone aircraft in eastern Iran and has threatened to respond to the violation of Iranian airspace, a military source told state television on Sunday.

"Iran's military has downed an intruding RQ-170 American drone in eastern Iran,"

Iran's Arabic-language Al Alam state television network quoted the unnamed source as saying.

"The spy drone, which has been downed with little damage, was seized by the Iranian armed forces."

http://www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/RestOfAsia/Iran-military-shoots-down-US-drone-state-TV/Article1-777875.aspx

Brings back memories of a far worse incident. Remember this. If I remember correctly some medals were handed out to some on the Vincennes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655#The_shooting_down_of_Flight_655

[Rollo 485]

Or a perfect democracy is the most shameless thing in the world.

The Muslim Brotherhood stands for the rule of a particular type of law, namely Sharia and Quranic punishments. This is far from the traditions of personal conscience, private judgment and the separation of civic and religious authority on which Western democracies rely. So where, I wonder do we go from here, and what affect will it have on the relations with Israel? Nothing good I shouldn't imagine.

Looks to me like big trouble is brewing if and when the Muslim Brotherhood and the Salafists take control of the government. Israel has enough problems with Hamas and Iran and add Egypt to that mixture and I forsee yet another war for Israel to fight to ensure its survival.

[The PIT 9,193]

Afghanistan terrorism as Shia Muslims targeted http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-16046079 not good for the future of the country.

[knocker 57,702]

Happy and a healthy New Year everyone,

Edited January 1, 2012 by weather ship

[k19 29]

Interesting that this thread has gone quiet at such a pivotal time

Iran are now threatening to cut off the strait of hormuz, with the uk today http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16435885 challenging their view.

[Rollo 485]

Iran seems to be trying to perfect the art of brinkmanship and it is to me extremely worrying,their news programme Press TV tries to ferment trouble almost everywhere and its propaganda against Isreal does Dr Goebells proud. I fear we need an internal revolution in Iran to settle things down but the goverment there is unlikely to be overthrown for some time yet in my opinion.

[PersianPaladin 426]

Iran seems to be trying to perfect the art of brinkmanship and it is to me extremely worrying,their news programme Press TV tries to ferment trouble almost everywhere and its propaganda against Isreal does Dr Goebells proud. I fear we need an internal revolution in Iran to settle things down but the goverment there is unlikely to be overthrown for some time yet in my opinion.

War against Iran is unthinkable. Disruption to oil prices could cause a serious world crisis, so I think the "internal meddling" route is what the US and UK are working on....

[Guest]

War against Iran is unthinkable. Disruption to oil prices could cause a serious world crisis, so I think the "internal meddling" route is what the US and UK are working on....

That point does not appear to affected the decision to invade Iraq.

[PersianPaladin 426]

That point does not appear to affected the decision to invade Iraq.

Iraq did not have the influence on the Strait of Hormuz that Iran has. This is a completely different kettle of fish.

Edited January 7, 2012 by PersianPaladin

[GulberwickWeather 555]

Yet another top Iranian nuclear scientist assassinated:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-16519304

So who is behind this string of assassinations? The obvious conclusion that everyone jumps to is either the US or Israel (or both) but I have to say I'm not so sure. These attacks seem to have been carried out with relative ease. The targets were carefully selected and the attackers seem to have evaded caputure (getting away on a motorcycle this time). This suggests that at the very least, if an outside power is involved they are using local proxies who blend in (Mujahideen Khalq or some such organisation). The Iranian authorities automatically point the finger at the US/Israel because thats who they'd like it to be but two other possibilities suggest themselves to me. One is that these killings are being orchestrated from within Iran itself by powerful people who are opposed to Ahmedinejad and his benefactors in the Islamic elite. One wonders if the trail could eventually lead to Rafsanjanis door? We may never know. Even if the Iranians had a suspicion of this kind they would never admit it as it would display how divided the Iranian hierarchy is, much more preferable to blame the usual bogeymen, the US and/or Israel.

The other possibility is that there are other states, particularly ones in the region, who have much to fear and much to lose from a nuclear armed Iran. Most notable among these is Saudi Arabia. What do we know about the Saudi attitude to Iran having nuclear weapons? We know for an absolute fact that the Saudis fear this as much as Israel does. Just after the Islamic Revolution, we now know that due to the fear that Iran was trying to acquire nuclear capability, Saudi Arabia sought and was in the process of receiving an "off-the-shelf" nuclear capability from China, via intermediaries in Pakistan (indeed they had already started to take delivery of the delivery system - Chinese built missiles when the US found out and put the kybosh on the whole thing fearing it could be used against Israel). We also know, from information released by Wikileaks, that Saudi Arabia was actively encouraging both the US and Israel to attack Irans nuclear sites. Finally what we in the West don't fully realise is the degree of distrust and indeed hatred felt toward Iran by Saudi Arabia and other countries in the region, why? One word - religion. Iran predominantly follows Shia Islam. Saudi Arabia and much of the rest of the surrounding countries follow the Sunni tradition. You cannot underestimate the strength of feeling between the two sides of this divide. The Sunnis regard Shia Islam as a herasy, not to put too fine a point on it Sunni and Shia hate eachother. It is comparable to the hatred that existed between Protestant and Catholic during the Reformation era. Saudi Arabia regards itself as having the pre-eminent position in the Islamic religion, being home to the two Holy Shrines and the most conservative form of Sunni Islam, Wahabbism. They perceive Iran, especially a nuclear armed Iran, to be a direct threat to that position and will do anything to prevent Iran and the Shia faith getting the upper hand.

It would be very easy then to point the finger at the usual suspects but I'm not convinced, I suspect a bit of false-flagging going on here, the US and Israel being conveniently blamed to cover the real perpetrators. My suspicion is this may be the work of the Saudis. These attacks are well planned and executed suggesting "on the ground" or perhaps even inside intel. But they are low tech (this latest attack was apparrently carried out by two blokes on a motorbike who attached some sort of magnetic bomb to the car and then took off). Yes the Israelis and the US don't want Iran getting their hands on nuclear weapons, but neither do certain others whose motives may be driven not by cynical politics, but by religious zeal.