In The News

[noggin]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1301713/The-crack-roof-world-Yes-global-warming-real--deeply-worrying.html

I keep saying that I ain't going to bother anymore, yet I persist.

See the comments below the article....it shows how polarised are the opinions of the great masses.

Peace and love to all.

[Gray-Wolf]

http://www.dailymail...y-worrying.html

I keep saying that I ain't going to bother anymore, yet I persist.

See the comments below the article....it shows how polarised are the opinions of the great masses.

Peace and love to all.

I think the losses from Greenland ,over the past 20yrs, are easily shown to be above and beyond natural variation just from the surface melt and the trace this leaves in the ice cores we take. Past periods of sustained surface melt would appear as eroded sections of the record and give a good glipse to the length of time the melt was sustained for. I wonder how much ice has accumulated over this past 50yrs compared with how much has been instantly melted the summer after?

EDIT: And more on the 'record breaking' summer we're having;

http://news.mongabay...eatrecords.html

with 17 nations posting all time heat records........that cooldown had better hurry along (and not just 2 months of winter weather this coming winter! LOL)

EDIT EDIT: Oh yeah , Zen and the Art of Saving the Planet........

http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/green-living/zen-and-the-art-of-saving-the-planet-2048029.html

Edited August 10, 2010 by Gray-Wolf

[Gray-Wolf]

Here's 'Wunderblog's' take on this record setting year (so far);

National heat records set in 2010

Belarus, on the western border of Russia, recorded its hottest temperature in history on Saturday, August 7, when the mercury hit 38.9°C (102°F) in Gomel. This broke the all-time record for extreme heat set just one day before, the 38.7°C (101.7°F) recorded in Gorky. Prior to 2010, the hottest temperature ever recorded in Belarus was the 38.0°C (100.4°F) in Vasiliyevichy on Aug. 20, 1946.

Ukraine tied its record for hottest temperature in its history when the mercury hit 41.3°C (106.3°F) at Lukhansk on August 1, 2010. Ukraine also reached 41.3°C on July 20 and 21, 2007, at Voznesensk.

Cyprus recorded its hottest temperature in its history on August 1, 2010 when the mercury hit 46.6°C (115.9°F) at Lefconica. The old record for Cyprus was 44.4°C (111.9°F) at Lefkosia in August 1956. An older record of 46.6°C from July 1888 was reported from Nicosia, but is of questionable reliability.

Finland recorded its hottest temperature on July 29, 2010, when the mercury hit 99°F (37.2°C) at Joensuu. The old (undisputed) record was 95°F (35°C) at Jyvaskyla on July 9, 1914.

Qatar had its hottest temperature in history on July 14, 2010, when the mercury hit 50.4°C (122.7°F) at Doha Airport.

Russia had its hottest temperature in history on July 11, when the mercury rose to 44.0°C (111.2°F) in Yashkul, Kalmykia Republic, in the European portion of Russia near the Kazakhstan border. The previous hottest temperature in Russia (not including the former Soviet republics) was the 43.8°C (110.8°F) reading measured at Alexander Gaj, Kalmykia Republic, on August 6, 1940. The remarkable heat in Russia this year has not been limited just to the European portion of the country--the Asian portion of Russia also recorded its hottest temperature in history this year, a 42.7°C (108.9°F) reading at Kara, in the Chita Republic on June 24. The 42.3°C (108.1°F) reading on June 25 at Belogorsk, near the Amur River border with China, also beat the old record for the Asian portion of Russia. The previous record for the Asian portion of Russia was 41.7°C (107.1°F) at Aksha on July 21, 2004.

Sudan recorded its hottest temperature in its history on June 25 when the mercury rose to 49.6°C (121.3°F) at Dongola. The previous record was 49.5°C (121.1°F) set in July 1987 in Aba Hamed.

Niger tied its record for hottest day in history on June 22, 2010, when the temperature reached 47.1°C (116.8°F) at Bilma. That record stood for just one day, as Bilma broke the record again on June 23, when the mercury topped out at 48.2°C (118.8°F). The previous record was 47.1°C on May 24, 1998, also at Bilma.

Saudi Arabia had its hottest temperature ever on June 22, 2010, with a reading of 52.0°C (125.6°F) in Jeddah, the second largest city in Saudi Arabia. The previous record was 51.7°C (125.1°F), at Abqaiq, date unknown. The record heat was accompanied by a sandstorm, which caused eight power plants to go offline, resulting in blackouts to several Saudi cities.

Chad had its hottest day in history on June 22, 2010, when the temperature reached 47.6°C (117.7°F) at Faya. The previous record was 47.4°C (117.3°F) at Faya on June 3 and June 9, 1961.

Kuwait recorded its hottest temperature in history on June 15 in Abdaly, according to the Kuwait Met office. The mercury hit 52.6°C (126.7°F). Kuwait's previous all-time hottest temperature was 51.9°C (125.4°F), on July 27,2007, at Abdaly. Temperatures reached 51°C (123.8°F) in the capital of Kuwait City on June 15, 2010.

Iraq had its hottest day in history on June 14, 2010, when the mercury hit 52.0°C (125.6°F) in Basra. Iraq's previous record was 51.7°C (125.1°F) set August 8, 1937, in Ash Shu'aybah.

Pakistan had its hottest temperature in history on May 26, when the mercury hit an astonishing 53.5°C (128.3°F) at the town of MohenjuDaro, according to the Pakistani Meteorological Department. While this temperature reading must be reviewed by the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) for authenticity, not only is the 128.3°F reading the hottest temperature ever recorded in Pakistan, it is the hottest reliably measured temperature ever recorded on the continent of Asia.

Myanmar (Burma) had its hottest temperature in its recorded history on May 12, when the mercury hit 47°C (116.6°F) in Myinmu, according to the Myanmar Department of Meteorology and Hydrology. Myanmar's previous hottest temperature was 45.8°C (114.4°F) at Minbu, Magwe division on May 9, 1998. According to Chris Burt, author of the authoritative weather records book Extreme Weather, the 47°C measured this year is the hottest temperature in Southeast Asia history.

Ascention Island (St. Helena, a U.K. Territory) had its hottest temperature in history on March 25, 2010, when the mercury hit 34.9°C (94.8°C) at Georgetown. The previous record was 34.0°C (93.2°F) at Georgetown in April 2003, exact day unknown.

The Solomon Islands had their hottest temperature in history on February 1, 2010, when the mercury hit 36.1°C (97°F) at Lata Nendo (Ndeni). The previous record for Solomon Islands was 35.6°C (96.0°F) at Honaiara, date unknown.

Colombia had its hottest temperature in history on January 24, 2010, when Puerto Salgar hit 42.3°C (108°F). The previous record was 42.0°C (107.6°F) at El Salto in March 1988 (exact day unknown).

National cold records set in 2010

One nation has set a record for its coldest temperature in history in 2010. Guinea had its coldest temperature in history in January 9, 2010, when the mercury hit 1.4°C (34.5°F) at Mali-ville in the Labe region.

[sunny starry skies]

netweather news......

I think we can now safely add Mark Serreze as a friend of net weather and his pointing us to this paper;

http://www3.intersci...ETRY=1&SRETRY=0

regarding changes to atmospheric circulation, due to sea ice loss is well worth both reading and digesting, (not , I repeat NOT ,a challenge to be shot down but read ,understood and discussed?)

It's not often we have a head of a global Organisation happy to help us in our endeavours (M.Fish included) so lets have a little bit of decorum even if we choose to dismiss the findings?

Hi G-W - very interesting paper indeed! This article would appear to support what you pointed out last winter and I thought was insightful at the time - that our unusual winter weather pattern (exceptional negative AO etc) was not a challenge to the concept of AGW, but actually a consequence of it, through modification of Arctic weather patterns. As the paper says, there's not enough data to be conclusive about it, but there are good reasons to suggest that some of these weather pattern changes have an anthropogenic cause. To add something else into the mix, there is evidence that solar activity can also be linked to shifts of certain weather patterns - not significantly overall temperature, but to alter the regional preponderance of meridonal vs zonal circulation patterns near the UK during solar minima. There was a paper on that not so long ago, not sure what the ref is. 1995/96 and 1996/97 had good cold episodes, as have the last two winters. I wonder if we see the two factors operating together, or whether the new changes in the Arctic (substantially increased and increasing open water in Septembers since 2002) will swamp the old subtle effects on our circulation. The test for our winters will be if such patterns recur during years of higher solar activity. {Note all this refers to UK weather patterns, not to global temperatures.} I think the past will increasingly be a poor guide to what future weather patterns have in store.

[Gray-Wolf]

I too found the paper sickeningly re-assuring!!! I suppose the pair of us would prefer to be dead wrong about how we see the present and future of our climate system.

The paper, last year, from a British Uni noting the statistical predominance of H.P. systems blocking the Atlantic over solar min did indeed seem to be made flesh by last winter synoptics.

Question being how long a lag time from min to it's influence here? With solar min now over we may not see the same propensity for blocking this year but we will see warm less dense air again across the areas of the pole with heat to shed and this will lessen the impacts of the early winter 'cold dense' air.

It's almost like the pole has now gained an 'Indian Summer' with a vast amount of heat to shed before the ocean reaches the magic -3 or 4c it needs to re-freeze. If you couple that with the equinocturnal gales then we may see the pack disrupted in it's formation across areas of the pole as L.P. systems (moving ever poleward) push into the basin with their associated warm sectors and winds.

The forecast Barents Low (in 5 days?) looks like a doozy with central pressure down as low as 970 mb. The Forming Greenland high further steepens this pressure gradient making for very stormy seas on our side of the Arctic Basin and blasting away the cold pool across the pole.

[Roo]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2010/aug/08/merchants-of-doubt-oreskes-conway

This book is certainly worth a read.

[Gray-Wolf]

http://www.guardian....-oreskes-conway

This book is certainly worth a read.

I like my Robins, Skylarks n' Buzzards just the way they are thank you very much!

We're only just getting Otters back in our rivers!!!

Any move towards legalising a cumulative poison upon the landscape just ain't gonna fly. ......

[Gray-Wolf]

http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/?report=global

July second warmest behind 98' and still top of the pile for the year so far!

We here a lot of talk about how 'cold' Russia is well the above draws that into sharp focus!

[sunny starry skies]

The New York Times put this story on the front page on the 14th - "In Weather Chaos, a Case for Global Warming"

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/15/science/earth/15climate.html

Discussed here - but very unusual for a major newspaper to make that link, and the NYT has got a few things wrong on AGW in the past too. Signs of a change in the media? Or are the changes now so obvious even the journos are getting it?

http://climateprogress.org/2010/08/15/new-york-times-front-page-story-in-weather-chaos-a-case-for-global-warming/

[bush]

SSS I really do not know what you are spluttering about. This has happened before. So what is the big deal now? Who gives a penny about the views of a particular journalist? This has happened before and will happen again.

[sunny starry skies]

Hardly "spluttering", but ignoring that insult - how about you take the time to comprehend the gulf that exists between the views of >97% of climate scientists (as reflected in published literature), and the reporting of climate science in the media, which has been biased in favour of "false balance" for most of the past year on the back of the unfounded allegations arising from the stolen emails. The result is confusion in the eyes of the public, a confusion that does not exist in the professional science community. Media stories tend to have been something like "climate scientists say X, but other people [almost universally not publishing climate scientists] say Y, which is the opposite of X". Never mind that all the different Y's are generally mutually inconsistent, the message to the general public is that there is a scientific debate about the very existence of AGW, which there isn't. There is a blog debate, but that is very different from a scientific one. The media seem to confuse bloggers, weathermen and political advocacy groups with professional climate scientists, and the consequence has been at best confused reporting, and at worst outright disinformation. But in the past few weeks there have been a few stories, no doubt brought on by the remarkable weather events of the summer, which are acknowledging the science without resorting to the non-story of stolen emails or the disinformation of a Peiser or a Watts. That, in my opinion, represents a large improvement from parts of the media.

Now the weather/climate issue is still a tricky area, but the message has to be clear that these remarkable weather events are more likely with AGW - you load the dice and reduce the odds of these extremes happening. Of course the media has the memory of a goldfish, and we'll have the same issues arise the next time an inch of snow falls on London...

Edited August 16, 2010 by sunny starry skies

[Gray-Wolf]

Some of the 'new' influences can be measured and 'seen' at play a lot easier than tracking down the 'extra heat' we are amassing.

When we re-read our papers on the Arctic Amplification and then read the paper M. Serreze linked us we can easily apply some of that 'circulation change' to the Autumns, post 06' (I'm sure it was present before but in Oct/Nov/Dec these days it's unmistakable), and it's impacts seem to becoming ever more noticeable with places ever further from the Arctic being impacted.

The types of 'weather' driven by our new circulations are only temporary (in my opinion) as once we are truly seasonal in the Arctic a more 'settled synoptic' will emerge.

This, to me, is the real 'get go' for global warming as circulation patterns make major changes which in turn set the scene for more warming. I'm sure the rapid climate shifts we see in the paleo record occurred just this way with a slow 'drip ,drip' for a century or so (until enough of the 'slack in the system was taken up) and then a rapid (20yrs?) step change to the new climate setting.

In the noughties we made the change from 'drip,drip' to 'rapid change' (IMHO)

[noggin]

I couldn't find a wholly appropriate thread for this, so I'm putting it here!

http://www.climatechangefraud.com/climate-reports/7491-official-satellite-failure-means-decade-of-global-warming-data-doubtful

Some dodgy satellite data here. How reliable is the data that we get? What is the most accurate way of recording stuff?

[jethro]

I couldn't find a wholly appropriate thread for this, so I'm putting it here!

http://www.climatech...g-data-doubtful

Some dodgy satellite data here. How reliable is the data that we get? What is the most accurate way of recording stuff?

That doesn't make good reading; what's the overall temperature rise in the last 30 odd years? Less than 1c - wonder what the error bars are?

On a more cheerful note, the Jodrell Laboratory, part of Kew Gardens has released a new study about how plants may adapt to climate change. The traditional line of thought has been that it takes years for species to adapt and so serious risks of extinctions has been a concern; this new study shows that plants have the potential to adapt far, far quicker than first thought - "The epigenetic level of natural variation can be adaptive and has the potential to be rapidly released, in a few generations, in contrast to genetic variation.â€

http://www.kew.org/about-kew/press-media/press-releases-kew/orchid-epigenetics/index.htm

[Gray-Wolf]

Well the guys who think we have a balancing mechanism in nature with higher temps and more CO2 favouring plant growth (and CO2 uptake) may need to rethink;

http://www.guardian....s-plants-carbon

If we loose plant's to drought then we begin to loose another CO2 sink, which increases CO2 and raises temps further leading to more 'extreme weather events.....'

Edited August 21, 2010 by Gray-Wolf

[jethro]

That's simple to solve - plant more drought tolerant plants. When it comes to the Rain Forest, I'm absolutely certain more damage has been done to the carbon balance by the felling of trees than drought - stop chopping it down would be a good place to start IMO.

[Gray-Wolf]

I'm sure for areas under cultivation that'd work J' but what of the 'wild places'? Doesn't seem like a couple of generations to 'adapt' is fast enough for drought situations (though may be for slow temp rises/slow precipitation pattern changes).

It's like Polar ice. Once it had lost it's 'old perennial' it was not able to recover, kill a rainforest's and your on the fast track to savanna or desert (once the soil horizon is gone its gone, once the thermohaline horizon is gone it's gone).

We know past warming trashed rainforest's and replaced them with grasslands (good job for the evolution of 'us') but this time around we only have a narrow band of Tropical left in the world (and not complimented with the current savanna's under tropical canopy).

I'm sure over hundreds of years rainforest's will encroach back into areas that are suitable for it's needs but in the short term? This , to me, is rapid climate shift. The worries of the 80's (Brazilian drought followed by Forrest fires and the destruction of great swathes of the Eco-system) can be imagined if we carry on with our current warming trend and ,the worry I have is it would only take around 15yrs to go from healthy Forrest to burnt stubs.

[Gray-Wolf]

'Hot records continue to fall with the tally of 'hot v's cold' running at 18-1 for 2010;

National heat records set in 2010

Palestine, the portion of the territories occupied by Israel that declared independence in 1988, recorded its hottest temperature since record keeping began on August 7, 2010, when the temperature hit 51.4°C (124.5°F) at Kibbutz Almog (also called Qalya or Kalya) in the Jordan Valley. The previous record for Palestine was set on June 22, 1942, at the same location.

Belarus recorded its hottest temperature in its history on August 6, 2010, when the mercury hit 38.7°C (101.7°F) in Gorky. The previous record was 38.0°C (100.4°F) set at Vasiliyevichy on Aug. 20, 1946.

Ukraine tied its record for hottest temperature in its history when the mercury hit 41.3°C (106.3°F) at Lukhansk on August 1, 2010. Ukraine also reached 41.3°C on July 20 and 21, 2007, at Voznesensk.

Cyprus recorded its hottest temperature in its history on August 1, 2010 when the mercury hit 46.6°C (115.9°F) at Lefconica. The old record for Cyprus was 44.4°C (111.9°F) at Lefkosia in August 1956. An older record of 46.6°C from July 1888 was reported from Nicosia, but is of questionable reliability.

Finland recorded its hottest temperature on July 29, 2010, when the mercury hit 99°F (37.2°C) at Joensuu. The old (undisputed) record was 95°F (35°C) at Jyvaskyla on July 9, 1914.

Qatar had its hottest temperature in history on July 14, 2010, when the mercury hit 50.4°C (122.7°F) at Doha Airport.

Russia had its hottest temperature in history on July 11, when the mercury rose to 44.0°C (111.2°F) in Yashkul, Kalmykia Republic, in the European portion of Russia near the Kazakhstan border. The previous hottest temperature in Russia (not including the former Soviet republics) was the 43.8°C (110.8°F) reading measured at Alexander Gaj, Kalmykia Republic, on August 6, 1940. The remarkable heat in Russia this year has not been limited just to the European portion of the country--the Asian portion of Russia also recorded its hottest temperature in history this year, a 42.7°C (108.9°F) reading at Kara, in the Chita Republic on June 24. The 42.3°C (108.1°F) reading on June 25 at Belogorsk, near the Amur River border with China, also beat the old record for the Asian portion of Russia. The previous record for the Asian portion of Russia was 41.7°C (107.1°F) at Aksha on July 21, 2004.

Sudan recorded its hottest temperature in its history on June 25 when the mercury rose to 49.6°C (121.3°F) at Dongola. The previous record was 49.5°C (121.1°F) set in July 1987 in Aba Hamed.

Niger tied its record for hottest day in history on June 22, 2010, when the temperature reached 47.1°C (116.8°F) at Bilma. That record stood for just one day, as Bilma broke the record again on June 23, when the mercury topped out at 48.2°C (118.8°F). The previous record was 47.1°C on May 24, 1998, also at Bilma.

Saudi Arabia had its hottest temperature ever on June 22, 2010, with a reading of 52.0°C (125.6°F) in Jeddah, the second largest city in Saudi Arabia. The previous record was 51.7°C (125.1°F), at Abqaiq, date unknown. The record heat was accompanied by a sandstorm, which caused eight power plants to go offline, resulting in blackouts to several Saudi cities.

Chad had its hottest day in history on June 22, 2010, when the temperature reached 47.6°C (117.7°F) at Faya. The previous record was 47.4°C (117.3°F) at Faya on June 3 and June 9, 1961.

Kuwait recorded its hottest temperature in history on June 15 in Abdaly, according to the Kuwait Met office. The mercury hit 52.6°C (126.7°F). Kuwait's previous all-time hottest temperature was 51.9°C (125.4°F), on July 27,2007, at Abdaly. Temperatures reached 51°C (123.8°F) in the capital of Kuwait City on June 15, 2010.

Iraq had its hottest day in history on June 14, 2010, when the mercury hit 52.0°C (125.6°F) in Basra. Iraq's previous record was 51.7°C (125.1°F) set August 8, 1937, in Ash Shu'aybah.

Pakistan had its hottest temperature in history on May 26, when the mercury hit an astonishing 53.5°C (128.3°F) at the town of MohenjuDaro, according to the Pakistani Meteorological Department. While this temperature reading must be reviewed by the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) for authenticity, not only is the 128.3°F reading the hottest temperature ever recorded in Pakistan, it is the hottest reliably measured temperature ever recorded on the continent of Asia.

Myanmar (Burma) had its hottest temperature in its recorded history on May 12, when the mercury hit 47°C (116.6°F) in Myinmu, according to the Myanmar Department of Meteorology and Hydrology. Myanmar's previous hottest temperature was 45.8°C (114.4°F) at Minbu, Magwe division on May 9, 1998. According to Chris Burt, author of the authoritative weather records book Extreme Weather, the 47°C measured this year is the hottest temperature in Southeast Asia history.

Ascention Island (St. Helena, a U.K. Territory) had its hottest temperature in history on March 25, 2010, when the mercury hit 34.9°C (94.8°C) at Georgetown. The previous record was 34.0°C (93.2°F) at Georgetown in April 2003, exact day unknown.

The Solomon Islands had their hottest temperature in history on February 1, 2010, when the mercury hit 36.1°C (97°F) at Lata Nendo (Ndeni). The previous record for Solomon Islands was 35.6°C (96.0°F) at Honaiara, date unknown.

Colombia had its hottest temperature in history on January 24, 2010, when Puerto Salgar hit 42.3°C (108°F). The previous record was 42.0°C (107.6°F) at El Salto in March 1988 (exact day unknown).

National cold records set in 2010

One nation has set a record for its coldest temperature in history in 2010. Guinea had its coldest temperature in history in January 9, 2010, when the mercury hit 1.4°C (34.5°F) at Mali-ville in the Labe region.

[jethro]

The trouble with taking weather events and conferring climatic consequences upon them, is that you can really read what you want to read into them.

Take the USA for example (chosen because of the ease of access to data) these are the figures for new records set so far this year:

Record Lowest Minimum Temperature

January 647

February 263

March 230

April 295

May 752

June 167

July 255

Record Lowest Maximum Temperature

January 1139

February 702

March 480

April 619

May 1334

June 500

July 752

http://www.ncdc.noaa...0&year=2010[]=US&submitted=Get+Records#recs

If you look at the figures here: http://en.wikipedia....weather_records

Highest Ever Recorded Temperatures

14 countries set new records in 2010

13 countries set their highest ever temperatures before the end of WWII

What does all this tell us in terms of climate change? I'd suggest sod all.

[weather eater]

We know the world has warmed, nobody denies that, only the reason for the warming. So it should be no surprise that heat records are more likely to be broken than cold. This would still be the case if the warming was being caused by natural drivers, so records cannot be used as an argument for AGW, however they do indicate that the warming has not ended, as some seem to believe.

[Gray-Wolf]

I think you need to update Wiki there J', as Mr Masters highlights it's now 18 'hottest' for 2010 and we're only 2/3 of the way through (oh ,and 1 cold!)

[jethro]

So there's four more hot ones to add for this year, that still only makes it five more than were set before 1945.

Individual yearly records are so meaningless, next year with an increasing La Nina could set a number of new record lows; would that confer that the globe is cooling, AGW is a sham? Of course it wouldn't and you wouldn't let anyone get away with claiming otherwise.

We have a 30 year trend span for a very good reason, to be honest even 30 years is a snip in climatic terms, it cannot reveal the true picture unless the time span covers the time span of natural drivers such as the AMO, PDO etc in both their negative and positive states.

Hottest since records began is just another spin story IMO, it's the kind of snippet you get on the back of a packet of biscuits.

[Devonian]

So there's four more hot ones to add for this year, that still only makes it five more than were set before 1945.

18 high record in one year compares with 13 in the years up to 1945?

Individual yearly records are so meaningless, next year with an increasing La Nina could set a number of new record lows; would that confer that the globe is cooling, AGW is a sham? Of course it wouldn't and you wouldn't let anyone get away with claiming otherwise.

They're not yearly records but records for the entire series?

We have a 30 year trend span for a very good reason, to be honest even 30 years is a snip in climatic terms, it cannot reveal the true picture unless the time span covers the time span of natural drivers such as the AMO, PDO etc in both their negative and positive states.

Hottest since records began is just another spin story IMO, it's the kind of snippet you get on the back of a packet of biscuits.

Biscuits? C'mon, who's spinning what here?

Anyway, 30 years is a reasonable and well established climate definition. And it's that for good reason.

[Gray-Wolf]

C'mon J' , you can't think weather 'records' are meaningless?

Most all countries have different 'start dates' for their data so the swathe of records before WWII merely reflect that the world was warming then (since 1850 we're told?) and that the globally cooled period (1940-1980) meant we had to wait a while before the steady rises in temp started to challenge , and then break, the past record.

Again , if you take these records in isolation you might convince folk of their meaningless nature but when set against all we see happening this year surely you have to think about an emerging pattern?

[jethro]

Can't be bothered arguing this point again. As far as I'm concerned if anyone wants to argue that record heat is meaningful, then the same people have to accept record cold has the same standard of importance; historically on this forum, record cold events have been dismissed out of hand. You can't have it both ways.

Have to say though GW, this "and that the globally cooled period (1940-1980) meant we had to wait a while before the steady rises in temp started to challenge , and then break, the past record." really made me smile. You're kidding, right?