Iceland's Eyjafjallajokull Volcano

[Guest North Sea Snow Convection]

At last, heard a plane about 8pm this evening. Nice to have one coming in on the flightpath from the channel once again

[Crepuscular Ray]

No flight times? under normal operations what are those, the airport under whose flight path/glide path that I live under has no such night time flight or noise restrictions and aircraft operate at all hours. It usualy gets busy from 11:00pm with plenty of stuff coming in at every hour/minute throughout the night.

Numbers of Passenger flights to and from airports such as Heathrow where the flight paths go over large number of residential areas are restricted between 11pm and 5 am, technically, although these times tend to get eroded round the edges. Whether this is an informal or legally-binding rule, I don't know.

Edited April 20, 2010 by crepuscular ray

[Mondy]

Statement on Icelandic volcanic eruption: Tuesday April 20, 2300

NATS welcomes new CAA guidance and reopens airspace

We are delighted to report that most restrictions on UK airspace began to be lifted at 2134 (local time) this evening, following new guidance from the UK’s safety regulator, the Civil Aviation Authority on restrictions to UK airspace as a result of the volcanic eruption.

Air traffic control services have resumed in the UK with the exception of an area over the north west of Scotland which continues to be affected by a dense concentration of volcanic ash. Based on current information this situation is not expected to change overnight. The situation continues to be dynamic as a result of changing weather conditions and the prediction of dense areas of volcanic ash. NATS will continue to monitor the latest Met Office and VAAC information and the CAA’s updates on the availability of UK airspace.

This brings to an end a period of disruption and uncertainty for air passengers. Our operation is fully staffed and already responding to the backlog of flights entering UK airspace. We will be working with the airlines and airports to resume normal operations as soon as possible.

Due to the scale of the disruption, it will take some time for flights to resume normal operations and passengers are advised to check with their airlines for the latest information about flights.

There are no further operational changes expected overnight and on this basis our next update will be at 0900 (local time) on 21 April.

[katemart]

Bah. Bring back the dust! (selfish, moi?)

Fraid I feel the same, ray. It has been beautiful round here - birds singing, fresh spring air, can hold a conversation on the phone without telling the person on the other end to hold on minute... Yes, I moved here knowing the airport was close, but the increase in the number of flights and the size of the planes has been massive since we've lived here.

[pottyprof]

Hi, just been on my site, floodwarn.

Checking the infrared satalite movie for last hour seems to show a more defined line coming from the volcano.

Anyone with any knowledge able to take a look and see if its signifigant as cams seem covered in low cloud.

Its on satalite page.

Not sure if its just an error with the latest hi res satellite pic or just something convenient but Iceland and the UK are under a mess of interference at the moment..

[Guest North Sea Snow Convection]

Numbers of Passenger flights to and from airports such as Heathrow where the flight paths go over large number of residential areas are restricted between 11pm and 5 am, technically, although these times tend to get eroded round the edges. Whether this is an informal or legally-binding rule, I don't know.

I remember going on a customer service course in an old job I had some years ago in Feltham, right next to Heathrow, and the planes were taking off right over the industrial estate there every minute or so at least. And then around 11am that particular morning, unmistakably, Concorde went over!

I used to live at one time about 5 miles from Heathrow, and had lots of planes, but that noise was just something else!! Deafening! The building shook even more than with the big jumbo's!

Edited April 20, 2010 by North Sea Snow Convection

[Mondy]

Volcanic Ash Advisory Center (VAAC) areas of responsibility:

So why did KLM, Lufthansa et al aim thier woes at London VACC (MetO) when in actual fact Toulouse VACC covers their countries?

Explains why yesterday the Meto (who I am no great fan of) quite rightly pointed out that they are the Northern European VACC outlet for aviation, not entire Europe.

Had anyone heard of VACC Toulouse btw?

[pottyprof]

Had anyone heard of VACC Toulouse btw?

Nope.......

Small area they cover...

[Mondy]

Hmm:

Ash found on engines World Airways cargo plane from Maastricht to Ostend (BE), grounded for inspection

http://twitter.com/AshAlerts

[snow raven]

I dont know what to think of the latest developments. All seemed very hasty to me.

Is it supposed the ash in the atmosphere isnt as deadly for planes as the general public has been lead to believe,

or

the airlines put profit before public safety?

I guess only time will tell.

[jamesbhx]

Hmm:

Ash found on engines World Airways cargo plane from Maastricht to Ostend (BE), grounded for inspection

http://twitter.com/AshAlerts

The latest from CFMU/NATS:

LONDON AIRSPACE UPDATE

.

AIR TRAFFIC CONTROL SERVICES HAVE RESUMED IN THE UK WITH THE

EXCEPTION OF AN AREA OVER THE NORTH WEST OF SCOTLAND WHICH

CONTINUES TO BE AFFECTED BY A DENSE CONCENTRATION OF VOLCANIC ASH

.

BASED ON CURRENT INFORMATION THIS SITUATION WILL REMAIN UNTIL

0600UTC ON THE 21ST APRIL

.

THE SITUATION CONTINUES TO BE DYNAMIC AS A RESULT OF CHANGING

WEATHER CONDITIONS AND THE PREDICTION OF DENSE AREAS OF VOLCANIC

ASH

.

NATS WILL CONTINUE TO MONITOR THE LATEST UK MET OFFICE AND VAAC

INFORMATION AND THE CAA'S UPDATES ON THE AVAILABILITY OF UK

AIRSPACE

.

THE CAA WILL ISSUE NOTAMS DETAILING AREAS WHERE AIR TRAFFIC

SERVICES WILL NOT BE PROVIDED DUE TO THE CONCENTRATION OF

VOLCANIC ASH

[Mondy]

As much as I hate politics, particularly Labour or Tories, she does have a point!

Shadow transport secretary Theresa Villiers said: "Labour must immediately commit to a full inquiry into this fiasco, which has caused so much travel misery and billions of pounds of economic damage.

"Six days into the crisis, we're suddenly told that there are actually levels of ash which are compatible with safe flying. The question angry passengers and airlines are already asking is why the government hadn't worked this out before the crisis occurred."

From the BBC

[SnowBear]

As much as I hate politics, particularly Labour or Tories, she does have a point!

They were actually following strict international guidelines as far as I can work out which said no flying in volcanic ash, any amount, so technically no inquiry will help as they were merely following protocol, what they have done though is now clarified somewhat just what the tolerances and thresholds. Appears that over the past few days things were not standing still behind the scenes with conferences and consultations being made with various authorities and companies and this evening we saw the end product of that, the lowering of the threshold, and opening of airports. Nothing will be gained from any inquiry as I see it. All the authorities within UK airspace followed that protocol, and to the letter and didn't sway from it until they got that clarification from aviation engineers and tests.

I am still disgusted at BA though, they of all people should have had a better respect for the CAA and NATS especially if they knew what was going on behind the scenes regarding all the tests etc.

[johnholmes]

They were actually following strict international guidelines as far as I can work out which said no flying in volcanic ash, any amount, so technically no inquiry will help as they were merely following protocol, what they have done though is now clarified somewhat just what the tolerances and thresholds. Appears that over the past few days things were not standing still behind the scenes with conferences and consultations being made with various authorities and companies and this evening we saw the end product of that, the lowering of the threshold, and opening of airports. Nothing will be gained from any inquiry as I see it. All the authorities within UK airspace followed that protocol, and to the letter and didn't sway from it until they got that clarification from aviation engineers and tests.

precisely

[Paul]

They were actually following strict international guidelines as far as I can work out which said no flying in volcanic ash, any amount, so technically no inquiry will help as they were merely following protocol, what they have done though is now clarified somewhat just what the tolerances and thresholds. Appears that over the past few days things were not standing still behind the scenes with conferences and consultations being made with various authorities and companies and this evening we saw the end product of that, the lowering of the threshold, and opening of airports. Nothing will be gained from any inquiry as I see it. All the authorities within UK airspace followed that protocol, and to the letter and didn't sway from it until they got that clarification from aviation engineers and tests.

I agree to a point, but there are plenty of volcanoes around the world to test this sort of thing on - why on earth did we have to wait for most of Europe to be shut down in order to test the tolerances and at the end of that change rules which have been in place since the 80's? It makes no sense to me!!

[The PIT]

So if they were testing engines too see what damage occurred and to find out how much damage has or not occurred so too issue new guidelines why didn't they say so earlier rather than saying nothing???

The fact that BA took to the skies and said we're flying anyway smacks more of bullying than new guidelines.

I suspect pressure has been put on suppliers as well as the CAA.

Tories sadly and pathetically trying to make an issue out of this which puts them down even further in my mind.

Anyway if the Jets have tolerated the ash and ash has got in the engine life should be shortened. If this is the case keep an eye for more engine failures on the future.

Back to Volcano seismic activity dropped over night and I can't see much on the cams

[johnholmes]

it is of course possible that extra pressure was exerted-it is after all a commercial world.

However, NATS and CAA are bound by IATA and ICAO international rules. Those rules, albeit as Paul mentions, from the 1980;'s, ALL pointed to ANY volcanic dust as being possibly catastrophic to aircraft engines. There have been at least 4 cases where jet engines stopped working at flight level and numerous others causing severe problems in flight. Thus the airline industry had no alternative but to play safe until various test flights by Met aircraft and commercial aircraft SUGGESTED that in CERTAIN circumstances the ban was too restrictive. I am certain that all parts of the airline industry will now be working to produce new guidelines in the wake of this event.

Of course this is the very first time that, other than the US area volcanic ash has blown across such busy airlanes,the second busiest area of commercial flying in the world. Stopping flights in parts of SE Asia is hardly likely to have the same dramatic impact as doing that over European airspace.

Nope.......

Small area they cover...

not true Potty as the link will show-far larger than the one for the UK

http://www.metoffice.../aviation/vaac/

the world is covered by VACC centres to monitor and report possible volcano problems

Edited April 21, 2010 by johnholmes

[john w]

On some points above,

Noise: Between 11PM and 5AM there is essentially a maximum amount of noise that is allowed, not a maximum number of takeoffs. In other words they allow for examble 1000db of noise from departing aircraft and 1000db of noise from incomning aircraft each night. If each plane send out 100db then that is 10 flights in and out. Obviously those are not the limits but that is the idea of how they work. It begs the question...as planes get quieter the number of flights technically can increase.

With BA last night that their long haul flights were in Class A above 20,000 with flightplans to egll egkk etc but at their point of departure some uncertainty about clearence in to the airports. They were subsequently put in to en-route holds and told to wait. So you have a number of aircraft above london holding and waiting, no wonder they opened up on the new advice.

On ash, time will tell I am sure. One test flight wont render the exposure that 10-15 flights through the ash would experience.

Still at least work will be normal

[The PIT]

Morning John

However don't you find it a bit strange that BA just announced they were going to land at Heathrow despite it being closed and suddenly when the circling over the country the ban gets suddenly lifted?

If they knew that new information suggested it was okay to fly why not announce the fact and then say they're flying across.

I smell something and it's not bad communication or sulphur rather the smell of money, loads of money and the biggest rats of them all lawyers.

Edited April 21, 2010 by The PIT

[john w]

I agree entirely PIT. Its very very odd as I see it. Those long haul flights would have left some 8-10 hours before they were at Heathrow. Time zones makes no difference, it still takes 10 hours to fly. So they were supposedly departing Vancouver (where one came from) ay mid-day our time. Now what sparks me as odd is how they ever got clearence to depart. I suspect the only way they wrangled it was by setting Glasgow or Madrid as their alternate airport as opposed to perhaps Gatwick or Stanstead (which is the more usual choice but not always).

Your correct once at London the aircraft would have been held by ATC as below 20,000 ft space was closed. However at that point the pilot would normally consider the alternate airport. That obviously did not happen. The pilots would have known some back room deals were going on. Its odd, very odd. If anyone was listening to ATC last night they would have heard some interesting traffic I am sure.

[Coast]

New thread here folks: http://forum.netweather.tv/topic/62347-icelands-eyjafjallajokull-volcano/