North American Weather (U.S.A & Canada)

[Roger J Smith]

Light snow and -1 C here, already more winter than we normally see before New Years, wonder if this presages some unusual snow and cold on the west coast later. I think it may.

[Mondy]

This was from Wed last week:

URGENT - WINTER WEATHER MESSAGE

NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE HONOLULU HI

947 PM HST WED DEC 5 2007

HIZ028-061600-

/O.CON.PHFO.BZ.W.0001.000000T0000Z-071206T1600Z/

BIG ISLAND SUMMITS-

INCLUDING THE CITY OF...MAUNA LOA AND MAUNA KEA ABOVE 8000 FEET

947 PM HST WED DEC 5 2007

...BLIZZARD WARNING REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 AM HST THURSDAY...

LINES OF CONVECTIVE SHOWERS ARE STILL EXPECTED TO AFFECT THE

SUMMIT AREA THROUGH EARLY THURSDAY MORNING...BRINGING HEAVY SNOW

SHOWERS AT TIMES. STRONG WINDS WITH GUSTS OVER 60 MPH HAVE BEEN

REPORTED OVER THE SUMMITS THIS EVENING AND WILL CONTINUE THROUGH

EARLY THURSDAY MORNING. THE COMBINATION OF THESE WEATHER PHENOMENON

WILL PRODUCE NEAR ZERO VISIBILITY IN BLOWING SNOW...MAKING TRAVEL

EXTREMELY TREACHEROUS.

SNOW ACCUMULATIONS OF 6 INCHES OR MORE ARE POSSIBLE...ALONG WITH

SIGNIFICANT DRIFTING SNOW. TEMPERATURES WILL FALL INTO THE 20S...

WITH WIND CHILLS AS LOW AS 5 TO 10 ABOVE OVERNIGHT.

TRAVEL TO THE SUMMITS IS STRONGLY NOT RECOMMENDED FOR THE REST OF

TONIGHT THROUGH THURSDAY MORNING.

A BLIZZARD WARNING MEANS THAT BLIZZARD CONDITIONS ARE IMMINENT OR

OCCURRING.....

It does snow on the summits in Hawaii, but never blizzards.

Global Warming? pfftt

[johnholmes]

John, I have attached a map of north america and pin pointed roughly were John and I live (John, I think I am close, if not let me now)

tks very much Roger its much appreciated

anyone else out there it would be good if you could post your area/twon/city please?

[Coopsy]

Hi John

I have attached a map of north america and highlighted where Roger, Debs, Whitefox and myself live. Also have highlighted Winnipeg as Kold Weather is keeping a close eye on this area.

[johnholmes]

Hi John

I have attached a map of north america and highlighted where Roger, Debs, Whitefox and myself live. Also have highlighted Winnipeg as Kold Weather is keeping a close eye on this area.

great tks

never been very good on N American geography other than the main cities

[Roger J Smith]

John, if you were reading my winter memories in that thread you started, the "snow belt" location where I was living 1974-77 was about near the top of the second "o" in Toronto on that map, and later on, I was talking about Peterborough which is about near the top of the second "t" in Toronto.

Not sure if I mentioned London Ontario where I lived for a while too, but that is about halfway from Toronto to Detroit in southwestern Ontario. That is also a snow belt area as you can guess from looking at Lake Huron.

Lake Huron is sort of like a useful version of the North Sea for winter lovers, it's a bit smaller and a lot colder but it stays ice-free most of the time.

[debs]

keep the updates, photos and comments about real winter coming into NW I find them very interesting indeed.

I would still like a map of USA and Canada with your locations marked on them if that is possible, including CC and Roger?

I saw your, what I would call 'scatter' map Roger but I'm old fashioned so would prefer if its not too much bother a 'real' map with place names?

Hi John,

Not sure if this link will work, but this is where I am http://www.expedia.co.uk/pub/agent.dll. If it doesn't come out then if you find on a map where Nova Scotia is then across the Bay of Fundy you will see the City of Saint John (again not to be confused with St Johns in Newfoundland). I am slightly NE of Saint John on the coast. Hope this helps.

TTFN

Debs

PS I used to live in Sheringham in Norfolk before moving Basingstoke for a while then moving to here.

[johnholmes]

tks Debs,

Roger kindly posted a map with you on it, see above, bet you find it(the weather) pretty different from se England?

fairly wet at times perhaps, and rather sleety compared to some of the inland states in USA and Canada? lot more snow than ever we see in this country though.

[debs]

Addit, more snow for Debs either way from this system; some pretty strong winds too. I guess you're used to it by now!

Hiya Whitefox,

Thanks for the inofrmation...yes I am getting used to strong winds and power outages...biggest lesson being that when the power goes out you freeze your ass off http://nwstatic.co.uk/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif . Mind you I am a Northern Lass originally so I can take it, why back in Sunderland we walked around in T Shirts to show how hard we were.... http://nwstatic.co.uk/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif

TTFN

Debs

tks Debs,

Roger kindly posted a map with you on it, see above, bet you find it(the weather) pretty different from se England?

fairly wet at times perhaps, and rather sleety compared to some of the inland states in USA and Canada? lot more snow than ever we see in this country though.

Yes John,

Weather definately different here. I have'nt had as many rainy days as what I was used to in UK, and I remember thinking one day, when it did rain, how nice it was to see the rain.....strange really but I actually enjoyed the rainy day. I do like it here alot more though, it may be cold but you get cold crisp sunny days more often than dank grey wet cold days that we get in UK.

Glad the map helped

TTFN

Debs

[BL.]

Just a note guys regarding this thread - really enjoy the constant updates, the continuous posts relating to copious amounts of cold, then blistering heat really does keep me hooked - probably my love of the extremes which leads me to think i will one day end up living out in the NE USA.

Gents/Gentesses , based on past experiences, at what point would you say that the seasons 'turn', noticeably, based on observations only? Obviously there are the official meterological dates regarding when one 'season' transfers to the next - but as i say, based on experiences, do these dates actually relate loosely to the 'realfeel' change in conditions? Is there a trend whereby you expect a certain weather to deliver around a certain date? Is this failry reliable?

Hope this makes sense http://nwstatic.co.uk/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif , quite hard to portray what is meant...

As mentioned - Is one of the best threds on here - Keep it up eh

[WhiteFox]

Just a note guys regarding this thread - really enjoy the constant updates, the continuous posts relating to copious amounts of cold, then blistering heat really does keep me hooked - probably my love of the extremes which leads me to think i will one day end up living out in the NE USA.

Gents/Gentesses , based on past experiences, at what point would you say that the seasons 'turn', noticeably, based on observations only? Obviously there are the official meterological dates regarding when one 'season' transfers to the next - but as i say, based on experiences, do these dates actually relate loosely to the 'realfeel' change in conditions? Is there a trend whereby you expect a certain weather to deliver around a certain date? Is this failry reliable?

Hope this makes sense , quite hard to portray what is meant...

As mentioned - Is one of the best threds on here - Keep it up eh http://nwstatic.co.uk/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/cool.gif

There are a few good reasons for moving to the NE US, or to Canada, among which (for me) is the seasons. If you are able, then you can get yourself a really nice house with a large plot of land in upstate New York or northern New England.

Anyway, I'd say that you first start to notice Winter in New York in November. Late November is when you can realistically get your first frost (the average first freeze is December 15th in NYC rather surprisingly), although this obviously becomes earlier the further north you head.

For spring, it seems to be around mid- to late-March when it starts to feel like spring. The thing about weather over here is that such extremes are possible; last year I was walking around Central Park in a t-shirt with temperatures around 21oC! That is an extreme exception, but the sources of heat and cold are not modified to the extent that you see in the UK; that is why we can see a temperature drop of 20oC over a 24-hour period. It is even more extreme in the Midwest.

As for summer, late May to early June. The temperatures generally climb; we get periods of temperatures rising followed by storms and then even higher temperatures. This carries on until the end of August when the first hints of Autumn come with slightly cooler nights, although days are still hot. Autumn really makes its presence felt towards the end of September.

This is only a guide of course; Last year saw an extended autumn and winter didn't really get going until the middle of January!

Anyway, looking ahead, the ensembles continue to point to something interesting for the coming weekend:

Note the temps and ppn for the 16th into the 17th. This could be a Significant to Major storm on the cards (often shortened to SECS or MECS over here; I believe it is Significant East Coast Storm (or Snowstorm) or Major East Coast Storm. There is a third category, Historic East Coast Storm such as the storm of February 2006 or the President's Day storms Part one or two). If the control run verified with 27mm of PPN over 28 hours, given a liquid to snow ratio of about 12 to 1, then that equates to 32cm of snow or just over a foot in old money. With 850 temps around -10 for the whole period it would be snow for the entire event.

There are a couple of runs which suggest a rain event, and as always at this distance the track of the system is key. Current ensembles means (as of 18z 10/12/07) show the following for Sunday:

And six hours later:

As WeatherForecaster used to say 'on the verge of a dream'....

Anyway, this picture will become much clearer once we start getting input from the relevant areas where the seeds for the storm originate. Believe it or not, the wave which eventually develops into the storm doesn't appear until late on Thursday, so it's a long week.

I'll leave everyone for now with the GFS 18z operational map for Sunday. Take a look at those isobars and ppn over New York. We have a rule over here that all the biggest storms happen on weekends; this could be what we need for verification!

12 hours later just for Debs:

[Coopsy]

Just a note guys regarding this thread - really enjoy the constant updates, the continuous posts relating to copious amounts of cold, then blistering heat really does keep me hooked - probably my love of the extremes which leads me to think i will one day end up living out in the NE USA.

Gents/Gentesses , based on past experiences, at what point would you say that the seasons 'turn', noticeably, based on observations only? Obviously there are the official meterological dates regarding when one 'season' transfers to the next - but as i say, based on experiences, do these dates actually relate loosely to the 'realfeel' change in conditions? Is there a trend whereby you expect a certain weather to deliver around a certain date? Is this failry reliable?

Hope this makes sense , quite hard to portray what is meant...

As mentioned - Is one of the best threds on here - Keep it up eh http://nwstatic.co.uk/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/cool.gif

The main change here is the winter kicks in around Hallowe'en. By Nov 1st is when the snow starts and stays, then by early April Spring will start, then by mid June summer and then by late September Fall. Lasy year on September 1st it was 30oC and on September 14th we had a foot of snow with tree limbs down across town.

[Roger J Smith]

The weather here in Vancouver on the coast is pretty similar to southwest England, the differences are probably more snowfall events in the winter months, although still not very many of them, and more sunshine in the summer. It tends to get dry here during July and then stays dry for the first half of August, this is not absolute but we often have modified drought conditions here by then. Other parts of the year are probably more similar to England, than the middle of summer or winter.

The mean monthly temperatures here range from about 3 C in January to 17 C in July. About 100 kms further inland it would be about -1 to 19 so more like southern Germany perhaps.

[jethro]

In a few years, I'll be adding myself and family to list of ex-pats over there, just got to get my youngest through school then we're off. No offence Roger, but we won't be moving near you, your comparison to the SW of UK is the final nail in the coffin, had enough of mild nothingness. Somewhere closer to Debs for us, can't wait.

[Michael Winston]

Link here to the Ice storm currently in the states:-

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7137682.stm

Looks pretty rough,

Regards,

Mike.

Edit: From Oklahoma Dept. of Emergency Management:-

''Winter Weather Event

December 9 - Present, 2007

On Saturday December 8, an Arctic airmass moved into Oklahoma from Kansas. As the cold air settled in across Oklahoma, temperatures dropped below freezing. A storm system moved across Kansas/Nebraska early Sunday morning and produced widespread freezing rain in Oklahoma, especially along the I-44 Corridor. Many areas received 1/4 inches of ice with some areas up to 1/2 inches by Sunday evening.

Additional freezing rain is expected through Monday night.''

Edited December 11, 2007 by Winston

[debs]

In a few years, I'll be adding myself and family to list of ex-pats over there, just got to get my youngest through school then we're off. No offence Roger, but we won't be moving near you, your comparison to the SW of UK is the final nail in the coffin, had enough of mild nothingness. Somewhere closer to Debs for us, can't wait.

Hey Jethro,

Its nice here, I can certainly recommend it. Houses are cheap too, with lots of land and they are desperate for immigrants to this area due to the majority of working age people heading off to Alberta to make their fortune. So its worth a try getting in here. Takes time though. Be warned.

To answer the question on Seasons I am a novice, my first winter here, but I was surprised at how noticeable the season changed from Fall to Winter. Slap bang on Decemeber 1st we had snow, and that snow is still on the ground. In the last 12 days I think I have seen the temperature above 0 degrees only twice and the highest it reached was 3 degrees, I have seen one "drizzle" from this which did nothing to penatrate the snow. I have been told, however, that the seasons are like that of England in as much as they are temperate.

TTFN

Debs

T

12 hours later just for Debs:

Oh Boy,

Looks like I better stock up on candles again, the power is bound to go out.....lol

Chers for the heads up Whitefox

TTFN

Debs

Edited December 11, 2007 by debs

[Coopsy]

Your right debs about the migration to Alberta, I speak to so many from the East coast. However I think it might change with the developments happening in Newfoundland, we'll have to wait and see I guess

Warming up slightly here, looking on for a chinook by Thursday so might see the first plus day in a month. Shame as all the snow is still here and was hoping it would stay for xmas as got family coming over.

[WhiteFox]

Super chilled!

I see that Emarrass, MN recorded a low temperature of -36oC last night. That's a staggering -32oF!

The record low for the 11th December is -38oC set in 1977, so not too far off. It really has been absolutely frigid across the High Plains and Northern Midwest for the past couple of weeks. Minneapolis hasn't been above freezing for at least two weeks and Fargo, ND has been struggling to get out of single figures......Fahrenheit!

[jethro]

Hey Jethro,

Its nice here, I can certainly recommend it. Houses are cheap too, with lots of land and they are desperate for immigrants to this area due to the majority of working age people heading off to Alberta to make their fortune. So its worth a try getting in here. Takes time though. Be warned.

TTFN

Debs

Hiya Debs,

We've checked it out and certainly looks very nice, as you said cannot believe how much house and land you get for your money.

We've already filled all the official stuff out, immigration said yes please, how soon can you get here so it's more a case of when we come across, not if. If we didn't think the youngest would hate to be dragged out of school to go half way across the world, we'd be on a plane tomorrow; kids eh, no sense of adventure when you want it.

Enjoy your seasonal weather, I'm very envious.

Dawn

[Coopsy]

Wow it almost got above freezing today for the first time in 6 weeks....almost. Minus 1.9oC. Positively balmy

Possible storm for eastern Canada this weekend, storm for BC this weekend and heavy snow around the Niagara region by tomorrow...plenty to watch out for

[Roger J Smith]

The latest storm system in the east has drawn 10-15 C air north into PA, NJ, NY and southern New England. Only about 5 C further north across the heavy snow cover. Some rain with this, but the main feature is a brisk windshift to cold WSW, already evident across MI and OH ... will lead to the classic Buffalo snowstorm set-up as these cold winds cross full length of Lake Erie and hit Buffalo area with 10-15 inches of snow tomorrow.

[mezzacyclone]

will lead to the classic Buffalo snowstorm set-up as these cold winds cross full length of Lake Erie and hit Buffalo area with 10-15 inches of snow tomorrow.

mezza dreams to live in this place one fine day,

flitting between the texas pan-handle for the summer thunderstorms (like Paul Sher's lucky Stormchasers) and Buffalo for the winter snowstorms,

what more could one possibly wish for?

[Roger J Smith]

Current winds at Long Point on Lake Erie (the Canadian side but essentially near the centre of the lake)

SW 80 km/hr G 105 km/hr

or about 50 mph gusting to 58

and this is of course about to hit Buffalo with squalls showing on radar just about into Buffalo now.

In these southwest snow squalls, such places as Niagara south, Prince Edward county (that peninsula you can see near eastern end of Lake Ontario on the Canadian side) and the east shores of Lake Huron and Georgian Bay get hit with 15-30 cms of snow, or even more in some cases. The northwest squall zones like Cleveland, Barrie and London get almost nothing from this direction.

[Coopsy]

Boring weather here, nothing but cloudy semi cold days, blah

[mettalfabrik]

i find this chart extraordinary..does the cold always penetrate so far south