The Next Ice Age

[Guest Daniel]

We are often told that is it global warming that we have to woory about and all the things it could bring to the U.Khotter summers with killer heat waves more storms and higher sea levels. But it is the onset of the next ice that we have to really worry about. If this was to happen it will bring a threat far greater than any warming could. for vast sheets of ice would burry the U.K all way down to London and to the south a arctic tundra climate will exist thus making the U.K unliviable. Today we have over 60 million people living in Britian and most living in places that would have been burried under ice in the last great ice age. during that time the U.K would have had an arctic ice cap climate with winter temps well below -50. If such conditions were to come again it would be the end of all life north of London as we know it. But what can turn a mild temperate climate into an arctic ice cap one out side the polar regions. The Answer could well lie in the warm Gulf stream. Since the end of the last ice age it has more or less been flowing northwards bringing tropical water all up the eastern side of the Atlantic and into the arctic. this is why you will never sea an ice burgs or pack ice floating on the eastern side of the Atlantic. Yet in the little ice age ocean temps were 5 degrees colder than now ice surrounded iceland and in the severe winters the north sea and englerlish channel sometimes froze and we had long period of deep snow and frozen rivers. Now if the little ice had got any colder than a tipping point could have been breached and we could well be in a new full ice age. but for some reason the cold winds of the little ice age went away and we became warm again. Now it is belived that in that period the gulf stream weakend a little and an interesting point is that this cold came after a very warm period in the Arctic. Now If the arctic warmed and more snow fell on Greenland. this would cause more ice to enter the sea and the end result that the Arctic Ocean would become colder and fresher. Now if there was a long enough warm spell in the Arctic enough snow could fall that would have a big inpact on the Gulf stream. If this happened there would be heat loss in the Arctic snd this would cause the ice to come back. At the same time a weaker gufl sftream would cause calling further south and that would allow colder winters with more snow. This could under the right conditions cause a locked cycle of cooling that will in time burry much of the U.K and europe under ice. This will not occurover night nut if the onset of the next ice did happen will will see a strong cooling in Europe and the U.K. at first this will bring more storms and higher rainfall. winters will be come much longer and colder and the growing season will shortern. after a time summers in the U.K and europe will become so cool that frost and snow will last all year and that is when the great ice sheets will start to build up. now an ice age conditions can last 1000 of years.

[kold weather]

Ummm, have'nt we been here before...like many times!

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=28181

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=28952

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=27342

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=27355

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=27085

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=26913

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=26141

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=26431

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=25986

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=25666

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=25171

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=24932

Those are only from the last 5 months or so!!!!

Really, do we have to keep posting the exact same thing over and over and over and over again!!!

I'll leave this one open, but at least for a little while I'll close anymore threads that are of this sort of nature.

One a month is okay I suppose, but as many as you've done Daniel!

Instead concentrate on this one thread to put your posts avcrss rather then make one topic after another of the exact same stuff.

Thanks.

[Guest Daniel]

Ummm, have'nt we been here before...like many times!

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=28181

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=28952

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=27342

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=27355

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=27085

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=26913

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=26141

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=26431

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=25986

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=25666

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=25171

http://www.net-weather.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=24932

Those are only from the last 5 months or so!!!!

Really, do we have to keep posting the exact same thing over and over and over and over again!!!

I'll leave this one open, but at least for a little while I'll close anymore threads that are of this sort of nature.

One a month is okay I suppose, but as many as you've done Daniel!

Instead concentrate on this one thread to put your posts avcrss rather then make one topic after another of the exact same stuff.

Thanks.

Ops I didn't realise that I posted that many in such a short pace of time. I suppose its easy to get carried away. I must have a short memory. I really didnt realise that I posted that many. I will have to try and remember to cool off for a while. I supose it easy to get carried away particully this year as its been much cooler than of recent years. Thanks for reminding me.

[Lincs Observation]

own up Dan you want to get to 1000 posts on one subject dont ya

so anyway interesting all the same..

LO

Edited April 9, 2006 by Luton Observation

[wolves78]

and there was me thinking it was called Ice Age 2 - THE MELTDOWN

[wellington boot]

Rather a lot of posts there daniel! I think a lot has been said about the gulf stream weakening though. Everybody knows about it now, at least among those interested in weather. All the research which showed that it has weakened by 30% in the last few decades was published in the papers. But, as you're clearly a bit of a scare monger, I feel i should say that not only do we have no idea of how much weakening it will take of the gulf stream to stop it, but we also don't even know whether the weakening will continue at this pace. And if it did stop, we don't know what the consequences would be exactly. And ice caps and ice sheets would be a long time coming i guarentee you. Summers wouldn't be cold enough for ice and snow to stick around, and you need a fair amount of water to make an ice sheet in the firstplace, so really, I wouldn't worry too much about that.

[acbrixton]

Ummm, have'nt we been here before...like many times!

I'll leave this one open, but at least for a little while I'll close anymore threads that are of this sort of nature.

One a month is okay I suppose, but as many as you've done Daniel!

Instead concentrate on this one thread to put your posts avcrss rather then make one topic after another of the exact same stuff.

Thanks.

A rather restrained post KW!

Regards

ACB

[Guest Daniel]

Rather a lot of posts there daniel! I think a lot has been said about the gulf stream weakening though. Everybody knows about it now, at least among those interested in weather. All the research which showed that it has weakened by 30% in the last few decades was published in the papers. But, as you're clearly a bit of a scare monger, I feel i should say that not only do we have no idea of how much weakening it will take of the gulf stream to stop it, but we also don't even know whether the weakening will continue at this pace. And if it did stop, we don't know what the consequences would be exactly. And ice caps and ice sheets would be a long time coming i guarentee you. Summers wouldn't be cold enough for ice and snow to stick around, and you need a fair amount of water to make an ice sheet in the firstplace, so really, I wouldn't worry too much about that.

I read in the British Isles Natural History book that the ice age cycle began as we know them when the land bridge between south and north America was formed. before then warm ocean currents went round the world in an weat to east dircetion. This ment that the north pole was cold but dry and little snow fell. but once this land bridge was in place it forced the warm currents to change direction and that how the Gulf stream began. it brought vast amounts of heat and mosture north into the poler regions and that cause massive snow to fall which inturn form the great ice caps over Greenland and that how the ice age cycle started. Now for what ever reason there are times when so much snow fell in the arctic it caused the great ice cap on greenland to expand and that caused the warm ocean current to weaken which ment less heat and that allowed greter cooling and under the right conditions ice age. Now Europe and Greenland are almost at the same Latiudude yet there no ice cap over northern Europe because of the Warm ocean current that brings tropical water all way up to the Arctic. now Any weaking will cause enough heat loss to cause even more snow to fall on the european side. also heat loss from the Gulf will cause pressure patterns to change which will allow more cold winds to blow down from the north and less winds up from the south. This what occured in the last little ice age. in that period there were many severe winters over Europe and the U.K this was a result of a much weaker trpical air flow from the south and constent freezing winds from the north. So far this year in the U.K has been much cooler that what we been used to. Although we not had a great freeze tempertures have been greatly suppressed and this is direct result of more winds blowing down from the cold north or East and the result is much lower Temps. Now A weaker gulf stream could be the cause of this. a Weaker gulf could mean that lows and highs form in a postion that favour more cold than warm. if this is the cause then in the comming years we will see a strong cooling trend and some really cold winters and over all cooler summers.

[John Cox]

Any weaking will cause enough heat loss to cause even more snow to fall on the european side. also heat loss from the Gulf will cause pressure patterns to change which will allow more cold winds to blow down from the north and less winds up from the south.

Hi Daniel,

Like whats been happening generally this winter.

Scaremongering?

MOI?

[Guest Mike W]

I think 1963 would be a better example. But the main cause of that if not the only cause of that was uncapped levels of SO2 and soot, in fact the last 'pea souper' in London happened on the eve of that very cold winter. Good ridence to the stuff.

Edited April 10, 2006 by Mike W

[Essan]

But it is the onset of the next ice that we have to really worry about. If this was to happen it will bring a threat far greater than any warming could. for vast sheets of ice would burry the U.K all way down to London and to the south a arctic tundra climate will exist thus making the U.K unliviable.

True, but not for several tens of thousands of years after the initial onset of the new Glacial

If a new ice cap starts developing across Baffin Island and the highlands of Labrador, and is still growing after several centuries, then we can start worrying about the very long term future.

[BLAST FROM THE PAST]

Just for fun, has anyone seen the snow depths in the USA? Mammoth 6 metres, Squaw valley 6 metres.....all the years I've been on the ski club I've seen 4/4.5 metre depth but that is a hell of a lot of snow? Is this what DR Robert FOX is talking about?? :lol:

BFTP

[BLAST FROM THE PAST]

Just for fun, has anyone seen the snow depths in the USA? Mammoth 6 metres, Squaw valley 6 metres.....all the years I've been on the ski club I've seen 4/4.5 metre depth but that is a hell of a lot of snow? Is this what DR Robert FOX is talking about??

BFTP

Just to update...it is a record at mammoth and they are extending their ski season...to 4th July?

BFTP

[Guest Daniel]

The Global warming lobby are truly amazing. they are going to desbrate lenghts to keep the global warming theroy alive. They even go to other planets in order to scare us. They say the earth could end up like Venus if we dont cut Carbon levels. not only that they like us to belive that we are the cause of earths cabon rises. Carbon dixoide is a natural gass that comes out of Volnanos and by the way human kind it not cause the massive carbon levels on Venus. No that been cause by the planets massive volcanos. Also Carbon comes out of our vocanos as well. They are many under water volcanos given of the gass and also carbon comes from forset burning as well. Carbon dixoide has been on earth since the daw of time and in more acient earths past it has been far higher than today. The global warming lobby love to scare us. They have been doing it since the 1980s and since then we are still here. there been no great disaster or massive warming and the date is being put of further and further into the future. The simple fact is they are asking us to make painful changes when it may not be nessury and for many countries life go on as normal. Even we are not really doing a lot by allowing massive air port expansion and the big boys are doing nothing. so life goes on. yes carbon levels have been going up but most of that could be natrual and nothing to do with us.

[the_white_stuff]

Hmmm, just a bit similar to your other topic on wednesday. B)

[Stratos Ferric]

The Global warming lobby are truly amazing. they are going to desbrate lenghts to keep the global warming theroy alive. They even go to other planets in order to scare us. They say the earth could end up like Venus if we dont cut Carbon levels. not only that they like us to belive that we are the cause of earths cabon rises. Carbon dixoide is a natural gass that comes out of Volnanos and by the way human kind it not cause the massive carbon levels on Venus. No that been cause by the planets massive volcanos. Also Carbon comes out of our vocanos as well. They are many under water volcanos given of the gass and also carbon comes from forset burning as well. Carbon dixoide has been on earth since the daw of time and in more acient earths past it has been far higher than today. The global warming lobby love to scare us. They have been doing it since the 1980s and since then we are still here. there been no great disaster or massive warming and the date is being put of further and further into the future. The simple fact is they are asking us to make painful changes when it may not be nessury and for many countries life go on as normal. Even we are not really doing a lot by allowing massive air port expansion and the big boys are doing nothing. so life goes on. yes carbon levels have been going up but most of that could be natrual and nothing to do with us.

Daniel,

Is that a straight copy from, erm, let me guess, erm...."Armageddon soon.now.com"; nope, that wouldn't be it: erm, what about..."Ice Age now".

You're nothing if not a broken record...

[Stratos Ferric]

Ops I didn't realise that I posted that many in such a short pace of time. I suppose its easy to get carried away. I must have a short memory. I really didnt realise that I posted that many. I will have to try and remember to cool off for a while. I supose it easy to get carried away particully this year as its been much cooler than of recent years. Thanks for reminding me.

Silly me, silly silly silly silly me. Silly me...silly silly me - I must have been eating too much chocolate ergo they have made more chocolate this year.

Daniel, you're right of course, this cold winter is, without doubt, the start of many threads from you to the effect that this winter is the start of the next ice age...

There's a few people on here who I'd love to meet in the flesh: they are of a type who are either quite brilliant - or else the opposite.

[RedShift]

Daniel.......... oh never mind.

[Metomania]

Just for fun, has anyone seen the snow depths in the USA? Mammoth 6 metres, Squaw valley 6 metres.....all the years I've been on the ski club I've seen 4/4.5 metre depth but that is a hell of a lot of snow? Is this what DR Robert FOX is talking about?? B)

BFTP

Interestingly, because people might not realise this, the huge snow depths in the Rockies have coincided with massive warm anomalies this winter. It has been the warmest winter in the Rockies in living memory, but with big snow depths in some resorts. So don't let anyone dare, even dare, start dragging ice age theories into that!

[Methuselah]

Interestingly, because people might not realise this, the huge snow depths in the Rockies have coincided with massive warm anomalies this winter. It has been the warmest winter in the Rockies in living memory, but with big snow depths in some resorts. So don't let anyone dare, even dare, start dragging ice age theories into that!

Very true, Meto...The warmer the air is, so long as it remains low enough, the more snowfall it can produce... Psychrometry 101? B)

[Guest Daniel]

Interestingly, because people might not realise this, the huge snow depths in the Rockies have coincided with massive warm anomalies this winter. It has been the warmest winter in the Rockies in living memory, but with big snow depths in some resorts. So don't let anyone dare, even dare, start dragging ice age theories into that!

Simple warmth can cause iceages. extra warmth mean more moisture and that falls as more snow. thus that in turn builds up the ice caps that would cause cooling. Right now more snow is falling in the polar regions. all iceages start at the end of warm spells. even the little ice age came at the end of a warm period. A report out today claims that the world is liviing beyond its means. So we need to current warmth period to go on in order for our crops to grow. Now if there was a cool spell over Europe and north america in which most of the Middle Latitude temperate food is grown caused massive crops failers that would bring about massive problems with food.

[Metomania]

Very true, Meto...The warmer the air is, so long as it remains low enough, the more snowfall it can produce... Psychrometry 101?

Indeed! B)

[Methuselah]

I doubt it'll stop them though! B)

[Methuselah]

Daniel: There have been underwater volcanoes ever since there have been oceans; there will still be underwater volcanoes when the Sun's journey through the H-R Diagram reaches the red giant stage, and it [the Sun] evaporates the last vestiges of water from the planet... We know that, We don't need Ice-Age-Now to tell us...But it still doesn't alter the fact that we are putting EXTRA amounts of GGs into the atmosphere OVER AND ABOVE that!

Even if the astronomical prerequisites for renewed glaciation are coming together, the fact remains that global ice-cover is still shrinking. And with 80% of our energy-production still deriving from fossil fuels, GH-forcing is here for the forseeable future, I think? B)

[MAF]

just to add to the discussion, i feel this is quite disturbing

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4897252.stm