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    Near Newton Abbot or east Dartmoor, Devon
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    Weather, climate, geology, agriculture, education, politics, people, truth

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  1. I've been belittled by being called closed minded - it's not MY tactic... I've not said, or think, that solar minimum has no effect, I just think (if I'm allowed to think and say that?) the effect is tiny. If I, or my views, aren't attacked I wont feel the need to defend myself or them. Ok, lets see something posted to debate, not more attacks on people please
  2. A debate but one in which only the opinions you want to hear is allowed? Is that a debate? Without the sun this planet would be a very, very cold rock - no one doubts that, I certainly don't. I do, though, (if I'm allowed to?) doubt that the solar cycle has much effect on weather or climate. But, again, it seems you're saying that sort of thinking should go somewhere else and the thread thus become self confirmatory?
  3. Otoh, when I've more time I'll try to find the paper this refers to.
  4. Having read what Ed and QS have said I'm ready to call it: that paper is bunk.
  5. I said "I'm not saying pollution is the full cause of noctilucent clouds just that it might be part of the cause." and I said that because that's what I think. I also linked to an article that says: "We are also in a deep solar minimum, the period of the sun’s 11-year cycle when it is least active. That means the ultraviolet radiation from the sun that usually destroys the water modules which form these clouds is less intense, so more of them can form. Human emissions could also be a factor. Over the past 130 years we have released more and more methane into the atmosphere, which means that more water modules are produced in the mesosphere. These clouds were once a rare sight for humans of the past to observe, first recorded only after the 1883 eruption of Krakatoa spewed an incredible amount of dust into the atmosphere. But since then they have become a more and more common sight." So, I think that the reasons for more noctilucent cloud could, amongst other things, be both the solar minimum and man made pollution. It seems you categorically rule out the latter?
  6. I asked "wrt noctilucent clouds could human made pollution be part of the cause of them?" You said "no" (not 'possibly', not 'could be' but 'no'). A 'no' rules out any other possibility - does it not? Or by 'no' do you mean 'I'm open to the possibility pollution might be involved'??? I pointed out your quoted text says pollution might be a part of the cause. I'm not saying pollution is the full cause of noctilucent clouds just that it might be part of the cause. How can I be closed minded for being open to that possibility?
  7. Please don't be both dismissive and closed minded Your quoted text (form the Met Office i think) says human made pollution might be part of the cause of them so your 'no' is contradicted by what you post...
  8. A prediction to cut out and pin on the 'weather predictions to check later' board.. Will occur where though?
  9. wrt noctilucent clouds could human made pollution be part of the cause of them?
  10. I agree. it would be nicer if people were not being described as closed minded. That would be nice.
  11. My mind is open to what the data shows, what observations show and what scientists say. Thus my mind is open to there being a solar effect on climate in that the tiny (considerably less than 1%) changes to solar output can have an effect on climate. My mind is also open there being a much bigger effect on climate due to the (30%+) increase in greenhouse gasses in the atmosphere and other anthropogenic changes. Is your mind that open? If it is we're in agreement edit: oopss, reposted this thinking it was an edit - doh!
  12. I'm not as complacent about the future as you are. I also feel responsible for what I do, and I know that if, (as a species), we were both more responsible, more grown up and more intelligent we could all live happy lives without needlessly and carelessly polluting the oceans, land and atmosphere and needlessly despoiling the biosphere beyond recognition. I can't just wave that away I'm afraid.
  13. Do you notice the sun fluctuate and the climate follow it? No, you don't. Does the sun's output vary? Yes, by tiny fractions of a percent - it really is a middling star of steady output and thankfully so.
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