cheese

Been a nice couple of days here.

East Lancs Rain tbf the hot weather in early September definitely wasn't too little, too late - at least for me. I'm still in summer mode until late September. Dark Horse I would say that fog is pretty common in Leeds, especially in spring when we get high pressure and a slack easterly flow. I tend to associate warm/hot weather in spring with foggy mornings and sunny afternoons.

TheOgre Cold March's seem to frequently lead to good summers too (2018, 2013, 2006 etc), so maybe we should all be hoping for a cold March. I get nervous whenever March or April are really warm because of 2007, 2011 and 2012 - all years with very good Marchs or Aprils followed by poor or even very poor summers. I'll happily sacrifice some spring warmth in exchange for a proper summer.

SunnyG It's been a pleasant afternoon here after rain this morning. Long sunny spells and not particularly cold (9C).

I remember Atlantic 252 It has felt quite spring-like in recent years. February last year was a classic sunny and mild February, as was Feb 2019. This Feb is unfortunately shaping up to be a mild but dull one.

raz.org.rain speaking of which, it’s 20 years in May since that film came out. I still remember the promo images showing Big Ben mostly buried in snow & ice. A wet dream for some on here I’m sure

raz.org.rain that's a good point. What constitutes an average summer is changing faster than ever.

raz.org.rain well in 2011 we were using the 1981-2010 averages. A normal summer using the 1961-1990 averages would definitely be seen as poor now, and to be honest I think those averages have very little relevance today (especially considering they coincided with a relatively cool period in Europe, at least in winter). An average summer using the 1981-2010 averages wouldn’t be too different to 1991-2020.

Summer8906 that would be a normal UK summer though tbf. Whether it’s good or not obviously depends on how you feel about average British summer weather (which for most of England & Wales is probably low 20s and partly cloudy - Scotland and NI obviously cooler).

*Stormforce~beka* last March wasn’t as cold as 2018 or 2013 though tbf

Mullet maybe a cold March wouldn't be a bad thing though? Look at March 2018, March 2013 and March 2006 - all cold months followed by very warm or hot summers. I doubt there's any real link between a cold March and a hot summer, but they do seem to occur in the same year quite a lot.

reef Hmm, fair point. February 1990 didn't have an air frost in Leeds. The lowest temperature that month was 0.2C. We haven't had a frostless winter month since then - even February 1998 had 2 air frosts. However the lowest temperature this month here is only 0.1C, so maybe this February will achieve that. It would certainly be very weird to get snow in a month that never fell below freezing. The Met Office forecast for here is dry throughout so I'm not sure if this month will end up wetter than average.

reef December was pretty horrid but January for most of the UK was sunnier than average with average rainfall amounts. From a snow perspective that's disappointing but I don't think you can accuse January 2024 of being relentlessly dull and wet. Indeed it's the 2nd sunny January on the trot.

joggs I've noticed that the Vale of York has become virtually snowless as well - there have been many times in recent years where we've had a decent snowfall but York has had nothing. I can only assume that the overall increase in temperature means places like York and Hull are usually on the wrong side of marginal now.

Settled nicely on all surfaces here. Belting it down.

joggs fully snow here but only an icing sugar dusting on the grass. Pointless.

Snowing here @ 85m asl

parhelion of course it doesn’t, but it definitely would have been encouraging to see snow reports from elsewhere by now

All rain and sleet in the Midlands it seems

stainesbloke In reality I don’t think the UK climate has ever been particularly changeable. Oceanic climates are probably the most boring climates on earth. By definition they are characterised by stable temperatures, low sunshine and a general lack of extremes. This was just as true 30 or 40 years ago as it is now. Snow has undeniably become less common but it’s important to remember that snow in lowland UK was never particularly common to begin with, which is why actual snowy winters like 1963, 1979, 1987 and 1991 really stand out. I grew up in the 90s and the weather I remember back then is largely the same as it is now, just warmer across the board. Winters are as grey and miserable as they ever were. Summer heatwaves are definitely more extreme though - and I would argue that summers now are much better than the 60s, 70s or 80s. If we got some of those 80s summers today this forum would be in meltdown mode, and understandably so.

Scott Ingham I would honestly rather have nothing. I have zero interest in falling snow that doesn’t settle, or transient slushy coverings.

It’s just going to be a horrible cold & wet day. Probably the worst kind of weather. Spring can’t arrive soon enough.

reef Indeed. Getting sunnier-than-average months in winter is like a double-edged sword. In one sense it's good because any sunshine at this time of year helps, but at the same time it almost feels like a waste when I think most of us would rather have a sunnier-than-average summer.

Dark Horse well I’d argue regular cycles of thawing and freezing are probably the worst from a slipping/falling perspective because most surfaces end up covered in ice. Climates that remain below freezing throughout winter don’t typically have that problem. I think the winters of central Finland and Sweden are probably the best if you want winters that aren’t extremely cold but don’t have frequent thaw-freeze cycles either. I do find this discussion interesting though because if you asked random people on the street in Latvia what they think of their climate I’m sure the response would be overwhelmingly negative precisely because the winters are dark and cold. Most people from Northern Europe would happily spend all winter in the Canary Islands instead.

Dark Horse winters in Latvia have warmed significantly over the past 30 years as well unfortunately. They are obviously still much colder than the UK but I certainly wouldn't go there expecting a winter wonderland from December to March. Indeed a big reason for the lack of cold in the UK today is precisely because our usual sources of cold (Scandinavia and Eastern Europe) are much less cold than they used to be. Looking at Riga specifically, summer temperatures are on par with South East England. Average yearly rainfall is 674mm which is similar to most of eastern, central and southern England (it's about 70mm higher than my nearest weather station). Summer sunshine is on par with the south coast but winter sunshine is on par with Glasgow.